Single Payer Healthcare?

[Area51]

The real problem is that there are too many fat asses sitting in the Walmart foldin' chair at the ball field. Then they go cryin' for someone to pay the bill when they cart their fat butt away for that quad bypass in a year or two. Throw in a pack a day of smokes, 12 pack and the double double bacon burger....and it's all good! Then send me the bill? I mean...WTF!!!

Hmmm, sounds like a project proposal for the stimulus package. Install elliptical trainers down the baseline fences. The regional youth sports health czar will record each adult's name, age and weight upon entering the grounds. (Since the youth sports health czar is monitoring the kids' physical activity and nutritional intake, it's natural that his/her responsibility will expand to include parents who will be at the event.) At the conclusion of pool play, adults will be given their time slots and elliptical settings for "health counseling". Once they finish their assigned counseling session, they will be permitted a visit to the concession stand, where, upon presenting their youth sports health ID number, they will receive their prepackaged nutritional supplements. It's for their own good, you know, and society will benefit due to lower healthcare costs in the future.

[GIMNEPIWO]

I remember hearing several years ago that in my parents generation ( born in the 20's ) prior to WWII that the majority of a families income went towards groceries ... then sometime after WWII the majority of a families income went towards paying a mortgage ... I'm wondering what percentage of the average families income in this era goes towards medical insurance bills ? ... ( for those who can afford it ) ... When we moved from NJ to VA in 1990, we saw a dramatic increase in the cost of medical insurance ( BCBS ) ... at that time, for the same coverage, we were quoted a figure that was way higher than we were accustomed to and almost twice our budgeted grocery bill ...

[Skarp]

I remember hearing several years ago that in my parents generation ( born in the 20's ) prior to WWII that the majority of a families income went towards groceries ... then sometime after WWII the majority of a families income went towards paying a mortgage ... I'm wondering what percentage of the average families income in this era goes towards medical insurance bills ? ... ( for those who can afford it ) ... When we moved from NJ to VA in 1990, we saw a dramatic increase in the cost of medical insurance ( BCBS ) ... at that time, for the same coverage, we were quoted a figure that was way higher than we were accustomed to and almost twice our budgeted grocery bill ...

Private insurance costs have gone up, and will keep going up, as the medical community has been forced to provide free or reduced-rate care/drugs/etc. to large categories of individuals. That has increased the amount that must be charged to actual paying customers in order to remain profitable. Insurance companies are actual paying customers that in turn must set their premiums based on anticipated future outlays. But as long as insurance companies are competing for your business in a free market (i.e., not colluding on pricing), insurance companies aren't the culprit.

It costs a lot of money to provide quality medical care. Doctors sacrifice years of their life and accumulate a mountain of debt to prepare for their profession. There's no way they will do that without a big carrot at the end. Drug companies invest billions on R&D. They won't do that without an anticipated profit. Hospitals are immensely expensive to operate. There is no way to get around these basic facts. No way to make those costs disappear.

Studies show that when health care is provided free of charge, people overutilize it...driving up costs for those who actually pay. The solution: people should have to pay for their own damn insurance. Policies with high deductibles that don't cover every little trip to the doctor's office (what percentage of those trips are really necessary, anyway?) are relatively inexpensive. And more people paying into the insurance system combined with lower utilization means lower costs for everyone (while those who can afford more inclusive coverage are still free to purchase it).

It's amazing what happens when you get out of the way and let prices be determined by actual supply and demand.

[weekend4trvl]

I remember hearing several years ago that in my parents generation ( born in the 20's ) prior to WWII that the majority of a families income went towards groceries ... then sometime after WWII the majority of a families income went towards paying a mortgage ... I'm wondering what percentage of the average families income in this era goes towards medical insurance bills ? ... ( for those who can afford it ) ... When we moved from NJ to VA in 1990, we saw a dramatic increase in the cost of medical insurance ( BCBS ) ... at that time, for the same coverage, we were quoted a figure that was way higher than we were accustomed to and almost twice our budgeted grocery bill ...

I remember the cost of coverage sky-rocketing in the early 90's. Then came Bill Clinton and his universal health care plan...in 94 when health care providers were trying to make it go away , they magically lowered our rates by 25% and it happened overnight. Health care is not supply and demand , it is price fixing just like the oil companies.

[Skarp]

I remember hearing several years ago that in my parents generation ( born in the 20's ) prior to WWII that the majority of a families income went towards groceries ... then sometime after WWII the majority of a families income went towards paying a mortgage ... I'm wondering what percentage of the average families income in this era goes towards medical insurance bills ? ... ( for those who can afford it ) ... When we moved from NJ to VA in 1990, we saw a dramatic increase in the cost of medical insurance ( BCBS ) ... at that time, for the same coverage, we were quoted a figure that was way higher than we were accustomed to and almost twice our budgeted grocery bill ...

I remember the cost of coverage sky-rocketing in the early 90's. Then came Bill Clinton and his universal health care plan...in 94 when health care providers were trying to make it go away , they magically lowered our rates by 25% and it happened overnight. Health care is not supply and demand , it is price fixing just like the oil companies.

lol. How comfortable is that tinfoil hat, anyway?

Do you have any idea how many eager-beaver attorneys there are in the DOJ and FTC who would love nothing more than to bust those evil oil companies on collusion and price fixing? Do you have any idea how difficult it is to form and maintain a cartel...or how impossible it is to hide external indicia of its existence? I didn't think so.

[carolinafan]

Insurance company CEOs make millions of dollars a year. How much schooling did they have to go through to get to this level...probably an MBA. So, they may have 5 - 6 years of school to pay back. Doctors must pay back at least 10 years of medical training. What do they make.....depends on their field. Do both deserve all the money they make?

If everyone paid their way (utopia), it would work itself out. However, that is not going to happen. When you are working poor and get a serious illness, you could potentially lose everything. Then you go on welfare and people that post on here complain about the handouts you are getting.

I have a cousin who has his MBA and works in NYC for a big financial firm. Unfortunately, he has a very rare brain cancer that requires extensive treatments monthly. He has insurance through his work. However, there will come a time when he will no longer be able to work and thus will lose his job. Guess what, no insurance company will pick him up (Cobra only last so long folks) with his existing condition. His medical bills are enormous! So, you are basically saying we should let him die because he could not possibly afford to pay for his medical treatment. Many of you on here speak out of both sides of your mouth. In one breathe the right spouts off about Obama's plan wanting the elderly to die off and not receive care....not that this is accurate if you read into the bill. How is it ok that my cousin, who is 37 years old, should be subjected to pain and suffering and ultimately, death, but the elderly should get the best of care there is? I, for one, believe both peoples should be offered the best care this country can give no matter what their financial status is.

Go ahead and fire away......I know my logic is flawed and I should be put out to the cornfields!

[Skarp]

Insurance company CEOs make millions of dollars a year. How much schooling did they have to go through to get to this level...probably an MBA. So, they may have 5 - 6 years of school to pay back. Doctors must pay back at least 10 years of medical training. What do they make.....depends on their field. Do both deserve all the money they make?

If everyone paid their way (utopia), it would work itself out. However, that is not going to happen. When you are working poor and get a serious illness, you could potentially lose everything. Then you go on welfare and people that post on here complain about the handouts you are getting.

I have a cousin who has his MBA and works in NYC for a big financial firm. Unfortunately, he has a very rare brain cancer that requires extensive treatments monthly. He has insurance through his work. However, there will come a time when he will no longer be able to work and thus will lose his job. Guess what, no insurance company will pick him up (Cobra only last so long folks) with his existing condition. His medical bills are enormous! So, you are basically saying we should let him die because he could not possibly afford to pay for his medical treatment. Many of you on here speak out of both sides of your mouth. In one breathe the right spouts off about Obama's plan wanting the elderly to die off and not receive care....not that this is accurate if you read into the bill. How is it ok that my cousin, who is 37 years old, should be subjected to pain and suffering and ultimately, death, but the elderly should get the best of care there is? I, for one, believe both peoples should be offered the best care this country can give no matter what their financial status is.

Go ahead and fire away......I know my logic is flawed and I should be put out to the cornfields!

Yes, it is. Irreparably flawed. You live in a fantasy land, where practical limitations imposed by scarcity don't exist. Nobody is supposed to suffer, and every want should be provided. It's like talking to a child.

[carolinafan]

Tell you what Skarp.....you are a number one a hole! I would be most pleased to drag your sorry right-wing, fox loving ass behind my car until you bled almost to death.....then take your insurance card away and see what you do from there. People like you will most assuredly go to hell.

Have a great day!

[Skarp]

Tell you what Skarp.....you are a number one a hole! I would be most pleased to drag your sorry right-wing, fox loving ass behind my car until you bled almost to death.....then take your insurance card away and see what you do from there. People like you will most assuredly go to hell.

Have a great day!

lol. And now the tantrum. Be still, little one.

Observe the moral self-righteousness underlying the child-like naivete. If you don't agree with the utopian vision, you are evil. Well while socialist utopias were busy slaughtering and enslaving countless millions, western capitalism created more wealth for more people than any system ever devised. But yeah...I'm the evil one.

[carolinafan]

Oh, no tantrum my dear boy...I really DO want to see you bleed slowly to death......

BTW, the Germans were one of the biggest military powers in the world in the 30s yet had an incredible recession/deficit going on....their power was due to fear and propaganda not their economy. Hitler was a mastermind of brainwashing the lower middle classes into believing he could save them. So, your theory about China getting stronger due to increased profits from their plastic wal mart toys is refuted. Just look at our reaction to 9/11 (in which I was at the epicenter and thankfully survived). We were royally pissed off and built our military to unprecedented numbers as a reaction to advisory and not because we had a few billion extra dollars in our coffers.