Shame on you PGF!!!

[ontheblack]

"Once a team has submitted its roster at a check-in for a Qualifying Tournament, all players registered to that team are frozen on that team until the team disbands, chooses not to enter further Qualifying Tournaments or finishes the final Qualifying Tournament and does not qualify for Nationals. Once a team qualifies for the Nationals, all players on that team are frozen until August 5, 2012".

The problem is that he did play in a qualifier, which froze his roster. The issue is when did they receive the at large berth. Was it after the team chose "not to enter further Qualifying Tournaments or finishes the final Qualifying Tournament and does not qualify for Nationals"?

PGF does need to define "qualify", as many teams that were invited have used variations of that term in their recruiting of players after being invited or given a berth.

As for the OP, I can understand your frustration, but part of me thinks you should just be grateful you were given a gift and STFU. If the girls left you after the invite, IMNSHO that potentially speaks more to your team than it does the girls who left. Being a p/u player is always a gamble. You could go and rarely play (not fun) or go and take away a position from an existing player (not something that endears you to a team with good chemistry). Adding two players to an existing good team is a risk on their end as well.

Funny that how some teams accomplish their season goals are the very things that frequently lead to their team's failure and demise.

[NumeroUno]

This post and TH 1/2 empty cup set a record yesterday for heybucket. We had around 10,000 unique visitors on the bucket yesterday.

[fastpitchdad05]

This post and TH 1/2 empty cup set a record yesterday for heybucket. We had around 10,000 unique visitors on the bucket yesterday.

Nice...Congrats!

[biggun]

you really are ALWAYS THE DRAMA. you have no idea what your talking about. do you have esp? are you purposefully asking a lot of loaded questions that are slanted to one point of view? did the parents tell you they were leaving to go to a "better team"? did the parents tell you personally that they didnt "hear what they wanted" from their original coach? are you privy to these parents and coaches deepest thoughts and personal conversations? did i ask enough questions to seem fair and balanced? annnd your a moron team az coaches and girls have never run around saying theyre the top dogs, their the best ect. any kind of self-congratulatory behaviour has been pride for the girls that make the team what it is. other people have put those words into their mouths based on comments parents have made, then runaway with it as if it is factual. some parents may feel that way and are vocal about it, that shouldnt be put on the coaches backs. regardless of whether you like the coaches or how they play the game they have worked hard to be the best they can be. as far as pick ups its always a touchy subject and the fact is parents do get upset but that something the coaches and the families will deal with good or bad not the public at large. it always amazes me how worried everyone else is about other peoples issues on teams they either arent on or dont even know. if you dont like the parents or the coaches then feel free to never join the team, otherwise do not speak about what you do not know.

[CULater]

you really are ALWAYS THE DRAMA. you have no idea what your talking about. do you have esp? are you purposefully asking a lot of loaded questions that are slanted to one point of view? did the parents tell you they were leaving to go to a "better team"? did the parents tell you personally that they didnt "hear what they wanted" from their original coach? are you privy to these parents and coaches deepest thoughts and personal conversations? did i ask enough questions to seem fair and balanced? annnd your a moron team az coaches and girls have never run around saying theyre the top dogs, their the best ect. any kind of self-congratulatory behaviour has been pride for the girls that make the team what it is. other people have put those words into their mouths based on comments parents have made, then runaway with it as if it is factual. some parents may feel that way and are vocal about it, that shouldnt be put on the coaches backs. regardless of whether you like the coaches or how they play the game they have worked hard to be the best they can be. as far as pick ups its always a touchy subject and the fact is parents do get upset but that something the coaches and the families will deal with good or bad not the public at large. it always amazes me how worried everyone else is about other peoples issues on teams they either arent on or dont even know. if you dont like the parents or the coaches then feel free to never join the team, otherwise do not speak about what you do not know.

There are very few unique issues anymore. LOL I can promise you that these issues have been around for 20 years or more. As far as people being worried about "other people's issues", the problem is that, in this situation especially, how PGF decides or decided to rule on the eligibility of the players will have an effect on other teams going forward. The precedent will be set. Unfortunately, for PGF, it will be set at the 12U level and could have an effect on all age groups.

IMHO, I don't see the invites going away anytime soon, so this situation could lead to teams making roster decisions based on the precedent. PGF is still young, so there will still be teams that qualify and don't go, or qualifiers that don't make, leading to teams that thought their qualification season was over, suddenly playing in a national with a drop down berth. So a hard, fast rule needs to be put in place.

[biggun]

good point CULATER. i just feel that alone should be the issue. the decision, not the events leading up to it. based on how the rules are stated now, there is wiggle room, no one did anything dirty. if people are up in arms about it and the majority feel the rule should be changed then that should be the issue. not the coach being so publicly upset, not the parents decisions.

[CULater]

good point CULATER. i just feel that alone should be the issue. the decision, not the events leading up to it. based on how the rules are stated now, there is wiggle room, no one did anything dirty. if people are up in arms about it and the majority feel the rule should be changed then that should be the issue. not the coach being so publicly upset, not the parents decisions.

I totally agree, but both coaches, in this situation, are probably being vilified, depending on which side of the fence you are on, because of the amiguous rule.

I think, most people, can relate to this issue, because if you have been around long enough, you have had something very much like this, happen to the team you are associated with. It's human nature to weigh in on the topic based on your perspective.

[AlwaysImprove]

I think you can end up in this situation and not have to vilify the coaches or the players. If Team A played in their last scheduled qualifier, and failed to qualify, and then choose to play in a less tournament or end their season, these kids would be right to seek out other PGF qualified teams. In fact the rules directly encourage it.

After these players were already on Team B, PGF calls Team and offers a berth. So far, everyone is behaving exactly as you would expect them to behave, as you would want them to behave.

Now the question is do you require those players to quit Team B, and go back to A? It is a sticky situation, and probably pretty rare. That is why you have a PGF board. To look into the situation, weigh the poor evidence that is available and render a decision which will be certainly criticized.

[CULater]

In a perfect world I agree with you. But in this situation you appear to be dealing with a coach who feels he has been wronged and parents who might well have been in a situation where pick up players took the spot of their kid. Emotions are going to be involved.

The way the berths are being passed down helped these individuals get to this situation.

If all teams are still eligible for a passed down berth, then the rosters should be frozen until all berths have been accounted for.

I guess one solution would be to make teams accept the berth at the time they qualify, or lose it and pass it down then, rather than wait 3 or 4 weeks.

[alwaysdrama]

you really are ALWAYS THE DRAMA. you have no idea what your talking about. do you have esp? are you purposefully asking a lot of loaded questions that are slanted to one point of view? did the parents tell you they were leaving to go to a "better team"? did the parents tell you personally that they didnt "hear what they wanted" from their original coach? are you privy to these parents and coaches deepest thoughts and personal conversations? did i ask enough questions to seem fair and balanced? annnd your a moron team az coaches and girls have never run around saying theyre the top dogs, their the best ect. any kind of self-congratulatory behaviour has been pride for the girls that make the team what it is. other people have put those words into their mouths based on comments parents have made, then runaway with it as if it is factual. some parents may feel that way and are vocal about it, that shouldnt be put on the coaches backs. regardless of whether you like the coaches or how they play the game they have worked hard to be the best they can be. as far as pick ups its always a touchy subject and the fact is parents do get upset but that something the coaches and the families will deal with good or bad not the public at large. it always amazes me how worried everyone else is about other peoples issues on teams they either arent on or dont even know. if you dont like the parents or the coaches then feel free to never join the team, otherwise do not speak about what you do not know.

Spoken like a true coaches wife. LOL
You also fail to see the good things , as well as maybe perceived bad ?, that were said about your team ? Typical. I picked on your team no more or less than Xtreme. As far as bold statements made by Team Az parents ? I guess you have esp too ? LOL You have been privy to every conversation over heard at the ball fields? Don't worry, before you get in a tizzy , other teams do it too. Nature of the beast, but to act as though your parents haven't bragged endlessly is hysterical in itself. The fact is both your teams should have gone to the dance with the kids that got you there in the first place.
Rules aside, both coaches are wrong no matter how YOU try to justify it.