Fork and Beans

[Informal]

These are minor children. Did their parents consent to them being filmed at this event? Did they consent to the video being released on a worldwide social media platform? Did they consent to their children being exploited by a company advertising video production?

Is consent required to film minors? and post their activities in public forums? Can someone follow our kids around a mall and record them shopping, or eating at a restaurant?

Where is the line? What are you comfortable with, when it comes I people you don't know filming your children's daily activity?

lol, Did you blame the Rodney King incident on the cameraman?

You make absolutely zero sense.

To answer your rambling questions... It is perfectly legal to video tape people in public places, i.e Areas where there is no reasonable expectation of privacy.

[Pale Rider]

Holy thread derailment Batman.

Amen...its not the video that's the problem...its WHATS ON THE VIDEO
Complaining about there being a video begs another question...Why attempt to deflect blame?
I got filmed probably 40x today...so did most of you...

[Bombbuilder]

Lots of questions to be asked here.


Peer pressure combined with an authority figure telling you that it's okay to do something immoral presents a tough dilemma. There have been tons of experiments that show that most people would have done the same thing in the same set of circumstances. That's why I'm asking.

I teach a course on Analytical Thinking and Moral Judgement, and we go over the Milgram Experiment pretty extensively. It is a fascinating experiment that teaches us a lot about human behavior.

I'm trying to think of a way to roll this video into a lesson.

[Safebyahare]

For the coach one 'F' up can ruin a thousand ata boys. It doesn't erase what he has done for girls of past.
The same goes for this video,,keep in mind the positive ones.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xVlKtI7yd_s
Recording images makes us better. It allows us to remember better and to share the experience.
The good and bad.

[softballblessings]

I'm sorry you don't go from upstanding, moral, good coach, to bad coach in one game! There had to be other incidents that the team did that they didn't get caught on prior to this one. Players don't go from knowing right from wrong in one game either. They are old enough to know better! Give me a brake it's not the company who posted it, it's not the bad umpiring, it's a bad group of girls and a bad leader that allowed this to happen. The coach and the players should be ashamed and called out. I wouldn't' even allow my DD to play for any organization if they allowed the coach to keep the team.

[NumeroUno]

I have never heard of one problem this team has ever had.

[jtat32]

I'm sorry you don't go from upstanding, moral, good coach, to bad coach in one game! There had to be other incidents that the team did that they didn't get caught on prior to this one. Players don't go from knowing right from wrong in one game either. They are old enough to know better! Give me a brake it's not the company who posted it, it's not the bad umpiring, it's a bad group of girls and a bad leader that allowed this to happen. The coach and the players should be ashamed and called out. I wouldn't' even allow my DD to play for any organization if they allowed the coach to keep the team.

What a great day - I found HB looking to improve my understanding of softball, and now I've found moral guidance from an authority who has clarity beyond that which Christ himself ever claimed to posses. Like you, I've never done anything stupid in my association with this sport, when I was the age of these young women, or at any other point in my life (not 100% sure about this, but I can't think of anything offhand), but I'm a bit of a newb at the whole judgement thing. I'm hoping you can help me with a few questions:

- I agree that they must have done some other stuff in the past. Nevermind the lack of evidence, there has to be other stuff, and probably a s---load of it. I get this, but where do we go from here? Do we come up with a list of probables (shaved bats, incorrect use of the DP/flex rule, etc), or do we just leave it as general thing? I'm good with whichever, BTW.

- This coach is clearly bad, as you said, in every softball, moral, and ethical sense of the word, as is this group of girls,. Is it all of them, though? Pitcher and catcher - nuff said. First base acted like she thought it was really a strike, so she's on the list, too. I didn't like the body language of the rest of the infield either, to be honest, and there was something about RF I just didn't like the looks of (granted, all I could see was a silhouette, but still- you know how you can just tell?). I wasn't sure about CF, LF, though, and the players in the dugout -what do we do about them? I'm guessing we go with the whole "birds of a feather" thing, but could it be that there might be one or two that could be potential candidates for salvation? Probably not worth the effort, but give me your thoughts.

Obviously, we need to get these people out of our sport. Let me know what you think, but I'm thinking about starting a new sanction. We'll call it the Righteous Softball Association, unless you've got a better name. I'm wondering what to do with the tolerance policy, though. "F up once and you're out" shouldn't be too hard for to live with for you, myself, and ours, but should we build in something for everyone else? I was toying with the idea of having the UIC perform confessions and absolutions at the field. Something like "forgive me father, but I left the bag early because the ump wasn't watching". On the other hand, if we limit participation to people like us, we can get rid of the umps all together.

Looking forward to your input, and I hope you'll expand beyond softball in the future.

[blackwidow]

jtat32..your post seems really angry in a sarcastic sort of way. I wonder if you have a personal investment in this coach or this team?

Are you saying that people do not have the right or the obligation to judge what they see on that video?

Are you saying that anyone who passes judgement is self-rightious?

Are you saying that because everyone has made mistakes in their past that we should be tolerant of this coaches lack of good judgement by putting his players in the position to even make this choice?

Obviously, we need to get these people out of our sport.

We actually do need to get these "leaders" out of the sport. A "leader" who would advocate this use of violence to solve such an inconsequential problem has no place guiding young women.

It's really that simple to my mind.

As for the players I chalk it up to a rather negative learning experience.

@safebyahare

That video you posted makes me tear up every time I see it...Thanks.

[Battle]

jtat32..your post seems really angry in a sarcastic sort of way. I wonder if you have a personal investment in this coach or this team?

Are you saying that people do not have the right or the obligation to judge what they see on that video?

Are you saying that anyone who passes judgement is self-rightious?

Are you saying that because everyone has made mistakes in their past that we should be tolerant of this coaches lack of good judgement by putting his players in the position to even make this choice?

Obviously, we need to get these people out of our sport.

We actually do need to get these "leaders" out of the sport. A "leader" who would advocate this use of violence to solve such an inconsequential problem has no place guiding young women.

It's really that simple to my mind.

The last half of your post contadicts the first half of your post. If he has a personal investment in the coach, why would he advocate removing him? I think you read between the lines a little too much. Nobody is trying to take away the right of speech and judgement. Good Grief!

[AlwaysImprove]

For the coach one 'F' up can ruin a thousand ata boys. It doesn't erase what he has done for girls of past.
The same goes for this video,,keep in mind the positive ones.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xVlKtI7yd_s
Recording images makes us better. It allows us to remember better and to share the experience.
The good and bad.

Maybe in your world one F up can ruin a thousand ata boys. Not mine. People make mistakes. They atone, everyone moves on. Just like they did in GA.

To those that say it is not the video, bs. I personally witnessed most of the major coaches lose their cool at some point. Saying things to umpires that were almost as bad, if put on video. I have seen coaches push umps, umps push coaches. Tirades towards umps that were so personal.

Many of the righteous indignifiers on this thread have either gone off, been sitting right next to the offender on a bucket. or been a parent on team with a coach that has went off. If there were video of that, it would be every bit as embarrassing. I suspect if you have been to a FC, CA, BB, MG game that was being officiated horribly, you would know exactly what i am talking about.

The difference here is that we have it in 1080p, off a steady and clear shot. Most of the other mom or dad shot videos are shakey and require explanation. Also if these hinterland teams with unsigned kids, no one would care, It's that we have a couple of kids with golden tickets and one of the major orgs that make this interesting.

Even the GA guys knew their game was on live TV. There is no expectation that things get spread wide and far, in broadcast quality, cut down to make it look as bad as possible.

That is a lesson all the major programs should review and consider. All these coaches coach very differently when they are down in Florida, or on PGF finals when they know they are on broadcast. If you are arguing they do not then you are full of it. Next time they see Williams behind the backstop it is time to coach like you are on TV.