Jury Idiocy Comes to Montana

[SkinnyFats]

Questions for Tumblebug:


1) Were high end metal bats safe in 1999?

2) Were high end metal bats safe in 2003?

3) If 97 mph is a safe exit speed, what would you consider an unsafe exit speed?

4) Do you believe that small decreases in exit speed cause small increases in safety, or do you believe they are non-linear?

5) Why do you think many college baseball players struggle to make the switch to wooden bats in the pros?

6) When a composite bat "opens up", has it reached the end of life of the product?

7) If two comparable bats are tested and found to have the same exit speed, but one has a significantly lower MOI than the other, what would be the difference in actual game performance of the two bats?

8) Should MLB batters be allowed to cork their bats? Why or why not?

9) Would you object to any of the following?

A) Increase the MOI restriction on metal bats to be comparable to wooden bats of the same length
B) Keep the exit speed the same, but make bats pass the test with a swing speed which varies depending on the MOI
C) Keep the swing speed the same, but make bats pass the test with an exit speed which varies depending on the MOI


Thanks,
SF

[Joe]

Questions for Tumblebug:


1) Were high end metal bats safe in 1999?

2) Were high end metal bats safe in 2003?

3) If 97 mph is a safe exit speed, what would you consider an unsafe exit speed?

4) Do you believe that small decreases in exit speed cause small increases in safety, or do you believe they are non-linear?

5) Why do you think many college baseball players struggle to make the switch to wooden bats in the pros?

6) When a composite bat "opens up", has it reached the end of life of the product?

7) If two comparable bats are tested and found to have the same exit speed, but one has a significantly lower MOI than the other, what would be the difference in actual game performance of the two bats?

8) Should MLB batters be allowed to cork their bats? Why or why not?

9) Would you object to any of the following?

A) Increase the MOI restriction on metal bats to be comparable to wooden bats of the same length
B) Keep the exit speed the same, but make bats pass the test with a swing speed which varies depending on the MOI
C) Keep the swing speed the same, but make bats pass the test with an exit speed which varies depending on the MOI


Thanks,
SF

10) Should Suzi be playing a position where she might get hurt? Should we measure her skill level before we put her on the field, i.e. reaction time, reflex speed, hand-eye coordination.

11) Are Suzi's parents at fault because of an inferior gene pool?

12) Should Suzi take up golf instead?

[SkinnyFats]

The grown-ups are talking now Timmy, go back to your room.

[Joe]

The grown-ups are talking now Timmy, go back to your room.

Oh yes, I've noticed a few adults in the conversation, but then there's this half-wit with
his #1 thru #9 rubbish...

[absdad]

Hey Tumblebug,



Does your DD pitch?

Mine has been hit twice by your bats and had two surgeries...she nearly lost the ability to have children due to an old 100mph Rocketech. Those are stats that LL doesn't keep.

Who do you think was at fault in those two situations? You, your daughter, Anderson, ASA (or whoever the sanctioning body was), the opposing team's coach(es), the batter, tournament director, field owner?

[Tumblebug]

I won’t answer the numbered questions here; I will be glad to answer them in another thread where they can be made relevant. Re-post them in the Anderson Q&A thread or start another and I will happily tend to all of them.

The questions are non sequitur with respect to the original subject as are most of Sam’s emotional contributions; which, in my mind, are unsupported by anything other than emotional anecdotes. He is upset that his daughter sustained injury. I get that. He wants to blame somebody or something for the event. My boys have sustained their share of injuries and it is heart wrenching to see your child in pain. I get that too. I feel for him and his daughter but, just as it was for the Patch family, the subject is emotional for him and the danger is based on chance rather than circumstances that can be eliminated by dumbing down the game. However, that won’t stop him from confronting me because I am one of the bad guys to him. I also get that. We all have our demons to tame.

The argument that softball is in some way more dangerous than baseball is an argument akin to the “which one is harder to hit” argument. I usually don’t involve myself because everything I have done to explore that subject leads me to the conclusion the neither is harder or easier, they are different but equally difficult. I believe that if we wandered through the safety (or danger) parameters you would find that the differences cancel each other and we are talking about nearly identical difficulty and risk.

Diamond sports are not for everybody. It was not meant as an affront toward anybody or their daughter. Diamond sports are difficult. There is an inherent risk in any sport and obviously diamond sports are not immune. It is important that all risks are known and knowable but you cannot mitigate probability with caution and still play the game, especially at the highest levels. Balls struck by any bat can reach speeds that may cause injury to players and spectators. Protective gear and caution should be used.

I am certainly not being brave with your DDs. I encourage you to comprehensively assess the risk. If you are not willing to take that risk, do something else. Nobody is holding you at gunpoint and telling you that DD has to risk injury. NOBODY! Nobody else is responsible for your DD’s injury if you decided it was an acceptable risk and allowed her participation. NOBODY! Nobody else is responsible for your daughter’s injuries if you didn’t take the time and do the research to educate yourself on the possible risks. NOBODY! Nothing and nobody are responsible except you. As a father I accept those risks. As a manufacturer I am careful to produce a product that is within the rules so that the risks are known and knowable and my product is competitive.

I think it is interesting that the bat is singled out as the offending element in a series of things that went wrong. The bat never touched Brandon Patch. A baseball hit young Mr. Patch. A ball with the mass and density necessary to possibly kill at speeds as low as 50 miles an hour was used to play a game with young men competing. How is it not the fault of the ball? The answer to that question is the same as the answer regarding a bat that has a known performance level that strikes that same ball. The young man was killed by chance, not a ball, not a bat, not a game, not a batter, not a coach, not a parent, not an organization, not a manufacturer and not the young man himself. It was a chance happening, an event that happened completely by probability, with no planning or deliberate intent. It was a tragic accident without fault. Accidents happen.

[Sam]

I won’t answer the numbered questions here; I will be glad to answer them in another thread where they can be made relevant. Re-post them in the Anderson Q&A thread or start another and I will happily tend to all of them.

The questions are non sequitur with respect to the original subject as are most of Sam’s emotional contributions; which, in my mind, are unsupported by anything other than emotional anecdotes. He is upset that his daughter sustained injury. I get that. He wants to blame somebody or something for the event. My boys have sustained their share of injuries and it is heart wrenching to see your child in pain. I get that too. I feel for him and his daughter but, just as it was for the Patch family, the subject is emotional for him and the danger is based on chance rather than circumstances that can be eliminated by dumbing down the game. However, that won’t stop him from confronting me because I am one of the bad guys to him. I also get that. We all have our demons to tame.

The argument that softball is in some way more dangerous than baseball is an argument akin to the “which one is harder to hit” argument. I usually don’t involve myself because everything I have done to explore that subject leads me to the conclusion the neither is harder or easier, they are different but equally difficult. I believe that if we wandered through the safety (or danger) parameters you would find that the differences cancel each other and we are talking about nearly identical difficulty and risk.

Diamond sports are not for everybody. It was not meant as an affront toward anybody or their daughter. Diamond sports are difficult. There is an inherent risk in any sport and obviously diamond sports are not immune. It is important that all risks are known and knowable but you cannot mitigate probability with caution and still play the game, especially at the highest levels. Balls struck by any bat can reach speeds that may cause injury to players and spectators. Protective gear and caution should be used.

I am certainly not being brave with your DDs. I encourage you to comprehensively assess the risk. If you are not willing to take that risk, do something else. Nobody is holding you at gunpoint and telling you that DD has to risk injury. NOBODY! Nobody else is responsible for your DD’s injury if you decided it was an acceptable risk and allowed her participation. NOBODY! Nobody else is responsible for your daughter’s injuries if you didn’t take the time and do the research to educate yourself on the possible risks. NOBODY! Nothing and nobody are responsible except you. As a father I accept those risks. As a manufacturer I am careful to produce a product that is within the rules so that the risks are known and knowable and my product is competitive.

I think it is interesting that the bat is singled out as the offending element in a series of things that went wrong. The bat never touched Brandon Patch. A baseball hit young Mr. Patch. A ball with the mass and density necessary to possibly kill at speeds as low as 50 miles an hour was used to play a game with young men competing. How is it not the fault of the ball? The answer to that question is the same as the answer regarding a bat that has a known performance level that strikes that same ball. The young man was killed by chance, not a ball, not a bat, not a game, not a batter, not a coach, not a parent, not an organization, not a manufacturer and not the young man himself. It was a chance happening, an event that happened completely by probability, with no planning or deliberate intent. It was a tragic accident without fault. Accidents happen.

More arguments directly from the bat manufacturer, whose only dog in this fight is selling current inventory and redesigning their entire line of fastpitch softball bats. TB is arguing against his company spending money and he could give a crap about our daughters' safety. They made these same arguments when ASA "dialed them down" from 100mph to 98mph.

Nice marketing ploy, though....rather than work towards a safer solution for the pitchers and maintaining their market, he tells us to just stay home and not play. I know that I'll never tell a kid to buy an Anderson bat in the future....and I see a lot of kids. Pretty stupid.

Funny how all that argue to keep the standard as it is either don't have daughters or have daughters that don't pitch.

[Tumblebug]

More arguments directly from the bat manufacturer, whose only dog in this fight is selling current inventory and redesigning their entire line of fastpitch softball bats. TB is arguing against his company spending money and he could give a crap about our daughters' safety. They made these same arguments when ASA "dialed them down" from 100mph to 98mph.

Nice marketing ploy, though....rather than work towards a safer solution for the pitchers and maintaining their market, he tells us to just stay home and not play. I know that I'll never tell a kid to buy an Anderson bat in the future....and I see a lot of kids. Pretty stupid.

Funny how all that argue to keep the standard as it is either don't have daughters or have daughters that don't pitch.

That reply is officially a case in point to my post.

Signed,
One of the Evil Manufacturers

[anonlooker]

Hey Tumblebug,

Nobody is arguing a switch to wood bats....its more of an argument to lower the BPF to 1.00....you guys can still make your non-wood bats....we just want them made less hot.

Does your DD pitch?

Mine has been hit twice by your bats and had two surgeries...she nearly lost the ability to have children due to an old 100mph Rocketech. Those are stats that LL doesn't keep. The sky is falling....the sky is falling....

You repeatedly reference your DD's surgeries in your 'overuse' posts... now you're using them to support your POV in 'hot bat' posts? Not sure how it works both ways.

[Sam]

Hey Tumblebug,

Nobody is arguing a switch to wood bats....its more of an argument to lower the BPF to 1.00....you guys can still make your non-wood bats....we just want them made less hot.

Does your DD pitch?

Mine has been hit twice by your bats and had two surgeries...she nearly lost the ability to have children due to an old 100mph Rocketech. Those are stats that LL doesn't keep. The sky is falling....the sky is falling....

You repeatedly reference your DD's surgeries in your 'overuse' posts... now you're using them to support your POV in 'hot bat' posts? Not sure how it works both ways.

She had two overuse surgeries and two surgeries due to being hit. Is that a problem for you?