PGF perspective on the ASA JO Cup - Full Count article

[fontana10!]

Goldball your post is spot on. I would like to add, calling all the coaches of the "Elite" programs to make sure they were still going to participate in PGF clearly shows he has some serious concerns. Otherwise, why call if you know your product is far superior? This is all about greed, not about the kids.

[as the world turns]

This is comical, all the whiny posters that could never get on the good showcase fields are now thinking this a great idea. Guess what, your weak TB teams won't get invited to this event either, and if they do, it will be the most expensive 2 and BBQ ever. Fools and their money............

[tbjd33]

This is comical, all the whiny posters that could never get on the good showcase fields are now thinking this a great idea. Guess what, your weak TB teams won't get invited to this event either, and if they do, it will be the most expensive 2 and BBQ ever. Fools and their money............

For the record... No complaints here. This tournament is a viable option to PGF. It mirrors what our boys do for Team USA and if USA Softball is going to establish a 16u team then why PGF? This is why the PGF powers are so quick to throw mud. Those of you without boys you'll never get it those of you that do, well you know how important JO's for boys are. Imagine that for your DD's.

Check this out:
http://web.usabaseball.com/article.jsp? ... =news_usab

This is the ONLY tournament the boys are chosen for Team USA. Why wouldn't softball do the same? With the full weight of USA Softball selection process behind them ASA places PGF to just another organization and tournament option.

End of the day it's about recruiting and winning is a by product.

[4th & Forever]

This is comical, all the whiny posters that could never get on the good showcase fields are now thinking this a great idea. Guess what, your weak TB teams won't get invited to this event either, and if they do, it will be the most expensive 2 and BBQ ever. Fools and their money............

For the record... No complaints here. This tournament is a viable option to PGF. It mirrors what our boys do for Team USA and if USA Softball is going to establish a 16u team then why PGF? This is why the PGF powers are so quick to throw mud. Those of you without boys you'll never get it those of you that do, well you know how important JO's for boys are. Imagine that for your DD's.

Check this out:
http://web.usabaseball.com/article.jsp? ... =news_usab

This is the ONLY tournament the boys are chosen for Team USA. Why wouldn't softball do the same? With the full weight of USA Softball selection process behind them ASA places PGF to just another organization and tournament option.

End of the day it's about recruiting and winning is a by product.

If ASA wants to say that you need to play in this event to be considered for any national team is just BS or they are not interested in putting together the best team.... For the most part the Team USA is chosen from the Collegiate and NPF ranks. Also out the JO team only 6 kids are incoming college freshman. The remaining 14 players and alternates are already college student athletes. Oh and of those athletes I believe 17 of the 20 played PGF...

However my major concern is the eligibility of our athletes. You can't tell me that once all this money starts getting put into play that teams won't go out and pay a top level pitcher or hitter to go and play for them. I spoke to several schools this weekend at the Mary Nutter Classic and trust me they are very concerned about this.

I am all for options. Different strokes for different folks. My particular team will be playing in two sanctioning bodies National tournaments because the dates allow us to.

But why do this now then for a National teams that don't yet have the Olympics to compete in? A JO team that is mostly college kids anyway? Oh and hold it 25 miles from PGF's nationals on the same weekend? Funny part is if ASA would have held their nationals here a couple of times in the past there probably wouldn't be a PGF. I hope TEAM USA does develop a 16u team. That would be great. However this is an 18u tourney... most of the top level teams that are playing for the $$$ will be running with upperclassmen... I didn't see in that TEAM USA Baseball identification tourney that they are paying the winners $40,000

I think this is just another horrible ideal for our sport and our girls... I can't stand the direction our sport is heading on sooo many levels... This is just another one.

[tbjd33]

This is comical, all the whiny posters that could never get on the good showcase fields are now thinking this a great idea. Guess what, your weak TB teams won't get invited to this event either, and if they do, it will be the most expensive 2 and BBQ ever. Fools and their money............

For the record... No complaints here. This tournament is a viable option to PGF. It mirrors what our boys do for Team USA and if USA Softball is going to establish a 16u team then why PGF? This is why the PGF powers are so quick to throw mud. Those of you without boys you'll never get it those of you that do, well you know how important JO's for boys are. Imagine that for your DD's.

Check this out:
http://web.usabaseball.com/article.jsp? ... =news_usab

This is the ONLY tournament the boys are chosen for Team USA. Why wouldn't softball do the same? With the full weight of USA Softball selection process behind them ASA places PGF to just another organization and tournament option.

End of the day it's about recruiting and winning is a by product.

If ASA wants to say that you need to play in this event to be considered for any national team is just BS or they are not interested in putting together the best team.... For the most part the Team USA is chosen from the Collegiate and NPF ranks. Also out the JO team only 6 kids are incoming college freshman. The remaining 14 players and alternates are already college student athletes. Oh and of those athletes I believe 17 of the 20 played PGF...

However my major concern is the eligibility of our athletes. You can't tell me that once all this money starts getting put into play that teams won't go out and pay a top level pitcher or hitter to go and play for them. I spoke to several schools this weekend at the Mary Nutter Classic and trust me they are very concerned about this.

I am all for options. Different strokes for different folks. My particular team will be playing in two sanctioning bodies National tournaments because the dates allow us to.

But why do this now then for a National teams that don't yet have the Olympics to compete in? A JO team that is mostly college kids anyway? Oh and hold it 25 miles from PGF's nationals on the same weekend? Funny part is if ASA would have held their nationals here a couple of times in the past there probably wouldn't be a PGF. I hope TEAM USA does develop a 16u team. That would be great. However this is an 18u tourney... most of the top level teams that are playing for the $$$ will be running with upperclassmen... I didn't see in that TEAM USA Baseball identification tourney that they are paying the winners $40,000

I think this is just another horrible ideal for our sport and our girls... I can't stand the direction our sport is heading on sooo many levels... This is just another one.

What I want to here is how the selection process is going to work. I can only assume they will follow USA Baseball. That is:

*Two tourneys... One in FL and the other in AZ usually with 64 teams.
*The goal is to give approximately 40 Golden Tickets half at each event.
*Those 40 players are invited to USA Baseball complex in NC for a week. With all expenses paid. Players are surrounded by dozens of hand picked coaches and scouts to evaluate each players. By the end of the week the TEAM is set.

Now why would that not be a great process and experience for our DD's. They could do the exact same process at OK City. Two of my boys have gone through the USA selection process and it changed the way they played and thought of Baseball forever. I would be honored to have my DD chosen if given the opportunity.

I'm sure the hard headed sand pounders will come out. Remember how many of you moaned and groaned when the JR National team was announced. Well this fixes those complaints. Oh and get over the $$ amounts of prize $$. You would have to yell at TCS and Schutt for the free helmets or any other tournament winning gift. The NCAA doesn't see a difference in cold hard cash or gifts. Ask OSU about Tattoos or USC about rides in a Range Rover...

As I said, it's not about Tropheys it's about our DD having the best opportunity in this game. I can say the team that wins the JO Cup has huge bragging rights in baseball I can only see the same for softball.

[PDad]

This isn't the first time ASA tried using their JWNT as leverage and they picked a horrible time to do it again. Two years ago, ASA said players needed to play in their Gold events (later expanded to ASA/USA) in order to be identified for the JWNT. The result was a few players picked up with other teams to ALSO play Gold - it really isn't effective at coercing teams to switch. The result was less HS players were chosen than normal for the JWNT because they didn't have all the best in the selection camp.

It's ridiculous ASA put this carrot out again now, only weeks after the JWNT and WNT selection camps. They had around 100 players at the open tryouts for the JWNT selection camp, 10 advanced to the selection camp with the invitees and 4 were chosen for the JWNT. It was a very fair process that could mainly be improved by expanding the open tryouts to more sites across the country.

FWIW, USA Softball also pays expenses for the players in the selection camp.

[exD1dad]

I think ASA is trying to flex their muscles & play their only card - (The National Team sanctioned body) & is doing so in the same way other sports do (without the prize money). However without softball in the Olympic's & that being the be all end all goal they're shooting blanks (IMHO) & how can tjbd33 compare baseball where boys have opportunities for a real career that pays monster $$$$ to softball is typical but apples & oranges in my book.

[tbjd33]

I think ASA is trying to flex their muscles & play their only card - (The National Team sanctioned body) & is doing so in the same way other sports do (without the prize money). However without softball in the Olympic's & that being the be all end all goal they're shooting blanks (IMHO) & how can tjbd33 compare baseball where boys have opportunities for a real career that pays monster $$$$ to softball is typical but apples & oranges in my book.

EX they are identical in process. Both have big $$$ opportunities. Both offer huge offers for college and that's a perfect comparison. Both offer the opportunity to represent USA world wide. Of course baseball has a bigger potential upside that's obvious. That isn't my point cause the possibility of making the MLB is so small it shouldn't enter a conversation. On that note you all complain about DD's not getting full rides well they are almost impossible for baseball. Hell 50% is considered an outstanding offer for baseball.

So my comparison is a parallel one... Travel teams at an early age through HS, YUP... Crazy parents thinking their kids are better than they actually are,YUP... Thousands of $$$ spent on training, equipment, travel, fees,dues,camps, etc, YUP... Large organizations taking advantage of our kids,YUP.... People there just isn't a whole lot different from baseball and softball.

Get your head out of the sand and realize this may actually be a very good thing for our DD's. American Softball Association will be around a lot longer than PGF. It's an institution and PGF is an organization. Get it!!

[Sam]

This isn't anything more than a $64,000 fundraiser for ASA. No more recruiting than would happen at ASA 18 Gold Championship. It won't affect the selection of the National Team one iota. The selection team will pick the players they want and won't consider how they did in. jO tourney. They will look at how they perform in college.

This is ASA marketing a fundraiser by actively lying to their customers.

Haning is no better, working his last years in ASA to destroy the Gold qualifying process in SoCal; effectively excluding Gold teams he didn't deem worthy of the attempt since he didn't want to waste his pitchers against them in the early rounds of DE qualifiers.

ASA is an institution alright. They routinely turn a deaf ear to their customer, which paved the way for PGF to form and flourish.

Both of these organizations could choose to engage in behaviors which would protect our kids instead of exploiting them. They could install maximum numbers of games per season, pitch limits on pitchers, dead periods when younger teams aren't allowed to play, certification of instructors, etc. they would rather focus on the easiest ways to make money off of our kids and their parents.the parents aren't demanding these types of changes.....it would shorten their conversations at the water cooler every Monday morning.

[AlwaysImprove]

The parallels are way more to when PGF started. There was a team that ASA was able to coerce to be their bullweather against the exodus. I think it was Texas Sudden Impact (not totally sure). As every other team announced they were going PGF, SI, pledged allegiance to ASA.

Then it dawned on SI parents. That to satisfy their wrong headed coaches ego, their kid was going to be on a team that would not be competing for a national tournament with other good teams, and there would be zero college coaches at that tournament. The team was quickly dismantled.

This time the team is a Wichata team. He gets a lot of teams to jump the gap, he may not go down as completely wrong headed ego maniac. Currently, my bet would be on this tournament being a fail. Even ardent anti PGF people see what ASA is offering and turn their nose. They are just not impressed with this offering.

I am not sure why ASA remains NGB for fastpitch. For that matter even why ASA cares, even slightly, about fastpitch. ASA is no longer representative of the community. I guess part of the reason is that there is no Softball in the Olympics, so I am not even sure you could go to the US Olympic committee and have a discussion about NGB in softball.

All of this is a clear attempt by ASA to get everyone to look in the rearview mirror, where they might catch a glimpse of distant past image of ASA being relevant.

The future of the sport is clear and bright. PGF + Womens College World Series now represents the ever growing face the competitive sport of softball. Even at this point, if the longshot of Softball in the Japan Olympics happens, it would only be a minor distraction from the course the sport is on.

Only time i even look at JWNT, or Team USA at this point is when this discussion comes up here, or one of the college teams I follow announces a kid getting selected. This second case is becoming more and more rare. I know only 3 schools, Fla, USF, Missouri even bother to report JWNT/Team USA selections. That is because these coaches have been recently or currently active in those teams.

I have little intention of a tit4tat back in forth with someone trying to remain relevant. I am gearing up for a great summer of competitive fastpitch, attending the Mary Nutter classic, getting ready for PGF, and getting super excited for watching the WCWS. All impressive displays of how this sport continues to become more exciting, more competitive, and faster paced.

Writing this in my post Mary Nutter Classic high, I can just wish that the next 5 years of this sport continue on this current path. Wow. Watching LSU just be so dominate in hitting, the overall spread of talent has gotten so diverse. Gone are the days of being able to predict the WCWS winner. The spread from top to bottom of the top 25 teams. Truly the national championship could be won by any of these teams. What I saw this weekend just continues to blow me away.

The problem, is how would ASA participation in any of what is currently relevant in sport help enhance it? We have just so gotten beyond the times of the massive umpire sandwich table and the tournaments in hells own last acre.