I can't take it anymore

[AlwaysImprove]

I will second DonnieS reply. MTR knows a ton about umpiring. His statements about recruiting appear to be more an effort to create a new reality. If you follow his advice you will find yourself behind the eight ball. .

[PDad]

I gotta disagree with Artomatic on the integrity part for a teenager & the poster who knew the kid who wanted to play closer to home exemplifies this. ...

Arto wasn't talking about the kid that changed her mind - he didn't quote that part of the post. Presumably, he was talking about the poster's attitude of "a verbal is like a pinky swear" and advocating verballing without really making a commitment.

For the record, Arto's reply was brilliant.

[exD1dad]

OK PDad, I get it, however (again my opinion) any 8th, 9th or 10th grader that verbals I would not look unfavorably upon them integrity wise should they not honor their verbal commitment & sign a NLI as a senior to a different school where they could pursue a field of interest that they discovered was their calling (my oldest discovered hers late in her Jr year). Of course the chances of that happening are few cuz all the $$ is usually gone & cuz coaches are chasin 13 & 14 year olds (except Ivy's & lower D's) & unless there is a pregnancy or sadly a recruit dies (like the Senior on my DD's Fall TB team who got picked up by a team this way) & there are no big opportunities for "late bloomers". Yet more reasons the system is terribly flawed.

It would take a several top recruits to blow off a verbals in this instance, which again I just don't see happening despite boys doing it on a yearly basis. Dammed if you do, dammed if you don't

[artomatic]

exD1dad, I understand your points, and I agree, things could be better, but I don't think recruiting will return to how it was even 7-8 years ago, when 5 official visits during a recruit's senior year were a reality.
My comment was more to the parent saying a verbal is not a contract, more like a "pinky swear" as PDad pointed out.
I just don't agree with that way of thinking.

I know it happens alot in football and basketball, but for the most part, very rarely does a softball recruit pull out of her verbal, from what I have seen.
I know it can happen, and I see it happening mostly when there is a coaching change or a coach getting fired...
JMO of course.

[Sftbll4ever]

Purely academically speaking. Most of your college non-athlete kids do not know what they want to major in AND for the most part, they will change their major up to 4 times or more. So, for kids not to know what they want when they verbal is no different than the senior or freshman in college that think they know what they want and change it over and over and over again.

[jonriv]

My comment was more to the parent saying a verbal is not a contract, more like a "pinky swear" as PDad pointed out.
I just don't agree with that way of thinking.

I guess that is the real question. Is it a contract or not?

[softball65]

I know this is a forum for the exchange of opinions but I have to say that I am not sure a kid backing out on a verbal commitment is an issue of integrity. Especially in the case of a what 15 maybe 16 year old kid whose trying to make very involved and long term consequences types of decisions...lets face it, that as time advances, things change....or at least can. These are not tiny, inconsequential decisions. Maybe that is an argument for waiting til the last minute but there are limited spots and if a kid has an opportunity to commit to ASU as a freshman or sophomore, it is really hard for me to sit and criticize that decision. In the example I provided of the kid committing to ASU and then uncommitting....I get it. Not saying it is ideal but I doubt she was the first or the last to do so.

I fully acknowledge that as a parent of a kid who may well be getting some attention in a few years, I am not smart enough on this process. But I will be smarter tomorrow, and more so the days after, and etc. etc. And so will my kid as she progresses through the process as we are already talking about these kinds of things and what is important to her and what isn't. Having spoken to the parents of scholarshipped kids at various universities (just bringing up convo with parents of players) I've learned pretty much across the board that they all learned arguably more, after they committed and once the girl was playing for the university. And in a few cases, some parents would have encouraged different decisions had they known what they know now. My point being, when do you say "I know enough to make a decision"? And with girls, there is the emotional component as well. As a parent, I'd much prefer my kid was selective and diligent in her process and made the perfect choice. But can and do things change? Absolutely. Does that means she wasn't integrous or that she didn't make the best most informed decision at the time? I don;t believe so. It's nice to be wanted and the first to say "I want you" clearly has an advantage. The key is the kid has to KNOW what she wants and what is important to her. I think it's hard to turn away a ASU when they come calling, not knowing if anyone else will ever come calling again... I find it impossible to beleive Universities are not aware of this possibility.

[softball65]

My comment was more to the parent saying a verbal is not a contract, more like a "pinky swear" as PDad pointed out.
I just don't agree with that way of thinking.

I guess that is the real question. Is it a contract or not?

Don't get me wrong on this, I am not saying a kids word shouldn't mean something, it absolutely should. But in the end lets face it, this is a business transaction and both sides will do what they believe is best for them. Period. If circumstances change, the deal is very likely to change. The school, for obvious reasons, really can't afford to back out on the deal and frankly the school has much less at stake at scholarships are year to year so their "investment" can be contained. Much, much higher consequences for the athlete who makes an impulsive, bad decision.

[AlwaysImprove]

My comment was more to the parent saying a verbal is not a contract, more like a "pinky swear" as PDad pointed out.
I just don't agree with that way of thinking.

I guess that is the real question. Is it a contract or not?

Does not matter, not one bit. If your plan is to get recruited, you had better not back out on that first verbal, unless you have a specific commitment from another coach. Period end of story. We can say they are only 15, we can say it is not recognized. We can even theorize about alternative realities where verbals do not mean anything. Those are just science fiction.

Probably better working from a reality based on people that have been trough it. You announce your verbal, you are off the market. It is very difficult and very rare for someone who has announced a verbal to even have a conversation with an second coach. Coach's do not like doing this, because it can get their recruits targeted by everyone else.

It does happen, but it is so out there and rare. You are more likely to get struck by lightning then to get approached by a second coach after announcing a verbal.

[jonriv]

My comment was more to the parent saying a verbal is not a contract, more like a "pinky swear" as PDad pointed out.
I just don't agree with that way of thinking.

I guess that is the real question. Is it a contract or not?

Does not matter, not one bit. If your plan is to get recruited, you had better not back out on that first verbal, unless you have a specific commitment from another coach. Period end of story. We can say they are only 15, we can say it is not recognized. We can even theorize about alternative realities where verbals do not mean anything. Those are just science fiction.

Probably better working from a reality based on people that have been trough it. You announce your verbal, you are off the market. It is very difficult and very rare for someone who has announced a verbal to even have a conversation with an second coach. Coach's do not like doing this, because it can get their recruits targeted by everyone else.

It does happen, but it is so out there and rare. You are more likely to get struck by lightning then to get approached by a second coach after announcing a verbal.

I was actually thinking the other way- the college backing out(or offering less than initially promised) I agree with what you are saying and it is probably the reallity. Is that not the real danger that all the power & control is with the shools?