The ejection of Justin Smith ... thoughts?

[GIMNEPIWO]

Any thoughts on the ejection of Justin Smith in Thursday nights game or how, as an Umpire you would handle contact such as this ?

http://nfl-facts-and-rumors.blogs.cbssp ... 8/26484601

When it first happened I didn't even see the contact on TV ... But the replay clearly showed there was a push ... I don't think Justin Smith knew he was pushing an Official ... and, the Official had his back turned, so he didn't know it was not an aggressive shove ... but does any of that matter ?

[HugoTafurst]

Any thoughts on the ejection of Justin Smith in Thursday nights game or how, as an Umpire you would handle contact such as this ?

http://nfl-facts-and-rumors.blogs.cbssp ... 8/26484601

When it first happened I didn't even see the contact on TV ... But the replay clearly showed there was a push ... I don't think Justin Smith knew he was pushing an Official ... and, the Official had his back turned, so he didn't know it was not an aggressive shove ... but does any of that matter ?

You probably meant to post this on a football board..

[GIMNEPIWO]

Any thoughts on the ejection of Justin Smith in Thursday nights game or how, as an Umpire you would handle contact such as this ?

http://nfl-facts-and-rumors.blogs.cbssp ... 8/26484601

When it first happened I didn't even see the contact on TV ... But the replay clearly showed there was a push ... I don't think Justin Smith knew he was pushing an Official ... and, the Official had his back turned, so he didn't know it was not an aggressive shove ... but does any of that matter ?

You probably meant to post this on a football board..

Actually, no, I didn't ... there was a vigorous discussion on the Bucket earlier this year about 'contact' with an official ... I was looking for thoughts as it related to softball ... I believe MTR in particular, had no tolerance for ANY contact ... this contact appeared to be somewhat incidental, plus the official 'sort of' set hinmself up for it by jumping in between two players ... In softball, we are told to step back and take numbers ... Now, suppose you or I, as an official put himself in between two scraping players and there was incidental contact ... ( assuming of course the players in your mind were not already ejected for scraping ) ... are they ejected now ? It's been kind of slow here, so just looking for topics I guess ...

[broadband]

Since we're on the path of the conversation, I agree with the call. The scenario of a NFL team where you are dealing with 350lb men with testosterone all over the field is vastly different than a girls fast softball game, however, in the scenario, and I watched the video highlight as well, there is no reason for a coach/player in fastpitch to put their hands on an official, regardless of the circumstances.

In the case of the NFL official, he has to deal with breaking up fights as part of the game being the norm vs. the exception. So from that aspect, this topic of using hands on the official for a NFL ref vs. a fastpitch softball umpire is a bit like comparing apples and oranges in my opinion.

[MTR]

I have no problem with the flag. The standard "heat of the game" argument bound to arise is bull. We are talking about adults.

The result of the flag (mandatory ejection) is an unfortunate, but necessary part of the penalty. However, I would not support a fine or suspension in this case. This is a portion I would leave up to the discretion of the league as to whether apply additional penalties or not.

OTOH, I do not support the NFL's position that the officials should step into any type of confrontations involving anyone other than another official. A couple years ago, an official did that during an altercation between a couple players and pulled a player out of the pile. If I remember correctly, the official was fined and suspended. How can you tell an official to go into an altercation and then punish him for the manner in which he acted to break it up?

Placing an official in the middle of these types of situations is just asking for trouble and it is always going to be the player

[soupy62]

Football and softball are 2 completly different sports i agree, however i think in both sports controled agression is something that needs to be practiced. In football once the whistle is blown the play is dead and the agression needs to stop, if you dont stop you take the risk of a penalty, thats it cut and dry. Its a different story if you back into a official that isnt paying attention that kind of contact wold obviously not come with a punishment but agressive behavior after the whistle should get you in trouble every time! With that said that sport in paticular would be tough to turn that switch off and on the way they do.
im a firm believer that coaches in softball should never ever act in an agressive way toward an official its tacky and classless! If an ump is wrong being an idiot isnt going to fix it! Simply discuss the issue with the umpire in chief during or after the game. If a coachs gets ejected during a tourney it should be for that tournament and another. If a coach makes any kind of agressive contact he should be arrested! The game is about the girls not the adults. Use the bad call as a lesson and teach the girls to move on and not let the negative things in life stop them from competing.

[Steve M]

...
OTOH, I do not support the NFL's position that the officials should step into any type of confrontations involving anyone other than another official. A couple years ago, an official did that during an altercation between a couple players and pulled a player out of the pile. If I remember correctly, the official was fined and suspended. How can you tell an official to go into an altercation and then punish him for the manner in which he acted to break it up?

Placing an official in the middle of these types of situations is just asking for trouble and it is always going to be the player

Mike,
I've spoken with that NFL official, at leat, I think he was the NFL official you are referring to. End result, from what he told me, was there was no fine of suspension. The player put up with a lot of grief from his fellow NFL players for letting an official pull him from the pile and throw hime to the ground.

[shockcoach]

NFL should treat it like the NHL does. Wait for the players to hit the ground before you break it up. You then play one man down for a couple of minutes.

[MTR]

Mike,
I've spoken with that NFL official, at leat, I think he was the NFL official you are referring to. End result, from what he told me, was there was no fine of suspension. The player put up with a lot of grief from his fellow NFL players for letting an official pull him from the pile and throw hime to the ground.

I cannot find it, but the concern was that he injured the player. Maybe I recall suppositions, but what I do recall is that the official was a Fightin' Blue Hen player in college.

I seem to recall that there was a statement by Jerry Sieman about how physical officials should get.

Nonetheless, I'm a firm believer that other than a boxing referee, no other sports official should ever intervene in a fight and that includes hockey.

[Sam]

Why weren't the police called?