ASA insurance never again

[jonriv]

So looks like ASA -Bollinger/Markel insurance is all a waste of money. One claim in 10 years and we were turned down. Nothing but PGF insurance from here on out

What are the stipulations on the PGF insurance? Are thay any different(as far as when you need to report an injurty etc..) I would assume they would be similar?

Just throwing it out there- what has peoples exoperience been when a claim was submitted within the 52? day window?

[jonriv]

My DD got hurt playing in a ASA Champions Cup two years ago. We went to the doctor and they said she had a deep bone bruise. She went to a physical therapist who specializes in sports injuries. She would leave feeling a lot better and sometimes with no pain for a week but the pain kept coming back. The therapist kept saying beside the bruise her legs were very muscular and tight and the IP band was tight and pulling on the knee causing pain. She played for a year and continued doing all the stretches and continued therapy. The problem got worse so we got her an MRI and she needed minors knee surgery. This entire time my business insurance was playing or I was paying for the therapy out of my pocket. I turned the claim into ASA insurance as a secondary insurance and they turned her down. Even though I have a paper trail for over a year they said the claim was no good because I hadn't filed it in a timely manner. She has had ASA insurance for 10 years and the first time we go to use it we get shot down.

Has anyone ever had to deal with ASA insurance before? I hope I never have to buy ASA insurance ever again

One letter we had was from Bollinger and now we get another letter from Markel Insurance Co.

Most insurance(homeowners, medical etc) has a time fram when things need to be reported- usually it is 2 years or less- sorry

[jonriv]

In my opinion...

The "timely reporting" is vague and somewhat arbitrary - a lawyer would have a field day and may be your best move to get them to provide the coverage. If they write the declination letter incorrectly (for example citing that you didn't report it in a timely manner rather than saying that the policy says you must report the claim within x number of days) you can twist that to say that you may have the coverage. Again, may be time for an attorney.

To me, the scariest thing in the accident coverage is that they stop paying benefits 52 weeks after the accident/injury. That is not nearly enough time for some of these injuries to be treated.[just as an aside, some other organizations - like PGF - cover injuries for as long as three years after they occur]

Teams purchase insurance like it doesn't matter. When you find out it does it is probably too little too late.

Agree 52 weeks is absurd.

Teams purchase insurance because ASA or PGF tell them they have too. ASA or PGF tell them they have too, so they can get pittance of a commission. It is a silly system. ASA or PGF would be better off asking teams for a bit more in fees, and tell teams they are responsible for being insured.

For the majority of the families, Bollinger is a complete waste of money. For those that actually need coverage, they are much better finding a policy with decent terms at a decent price.

Is it to make a "commission" or is to CYA for liability purposes??

I think all organizations need to do a better job of describing what is(and what is not) covered and how to report an injury. I would be willing to bet that the vast majority of TB players/parents out there are not even aware that some of their team fees have gone towards insurance

[AlwaysImprove]

How much is ASA finders fee? 50%? More?

BTW. It seems I am singling out ASA for this issue. I want to make it clear, most other organizations make the mistake of entangling their insurance premiums with finders fees and kickbacks. NSA, PGF, all have a nebulous insurance that you buy, that is likely worth about half what you are paying. When you look at where the money is going, the organizations are often getting about half the money.

ASA looks worse because they act like they deserve that money somehow. That it is ok to have an organization that charges everyone for insurance that only umpires can use. If you think that is fine, then either you are an umpire/ASA official or a not very smart coach/parent.

.

[AlwaysImprove]

In my opinion...

The "timely reporting" is vague and somewhat arbitrary - a lawyer would have a field day and may be your best move to get them to provide the coverage. If they write the declination letter incorrectly (for example citing that you didn't report it in a timely manner rather than saying that the policy says you must report the claim within x number of days) you can twist that to say that you may have the coverage. Again, may be time for an attorney.

To me, the scariest thing in the accident coverage is that they stop paying benefits 52 weeks after the accident/injury. That is not nearly enough time for some of these injuries to be treated.[just as an aside, some other organizations - like PGF - cover injuries for as long as three years after they occur]

Teams purchase insurance like it doesn't matter. When you find out it does it is probably too little too late.

Agree 52 weeks is absurd.

Teams purchase insurance because ASA or PGF tell them they have too. ASA or PGF tell them they have too, so they can get pittance of a commission. It is a silly system. ASA or PGF would be better off asking teams for a bit more in fees, and tell teams they are responsible for being insured.

For the majority of the families, Bollinger is a complete waste of money. For those that actually need coverage, they are much better finding a policy with decent terms at a decent price.

Is it to make a "commission" or is to CYA for liability purposes??

I think all organizations need to do a better job of describing what is(and what is not) covered and how to report an injury. I would be willing to bet that the vast majority of TB players/parents out there are not even aware that some of their team fees have gone towards insurance

Actually most of the coaches I know think their ASA fee is largely to buy insurance. They are not sure what else they get from ASA, since they pay $400 for tournaments.

[jonriv]

In my opinion...

The "timely reporting" is vague and somewhat arbitrary - a lawyer would have a field day and may be your best move to get them to provide the coverage. If they write the declination letter incorrectly (for example citing that you didn't report it in a timely manner rather than saying that the policy says you must report the claim within x number of days) you can twist that to say that you may have the coverage. Again, may be time for an attorney.

To me, the scariest thing in the accident coverage is that they stop paying benefits 52 weeks after the accident/injury. That is not nearly enough time for some of these injuries to be treated.[just as an aside, some other organizations - like PGF - cover injuries for as long as three years after they occur]

Teams purchase insurance like it doesn't matter. When you find out it does it is probably too little too late.

Agree 52 weeks is absurd.

Teams purchase insurance because ASA or PGF tell them they have too. ASA or PGF tell them they have too, so they can get pittance of a commission. It is a silly system. ASA or PGF would be better off asking teams for a bit more in fees, and tell teams they are responsible for being insured.

For the majority of the families, Bollinger is a complete waste of money. For those that actually need coverage, they are much better finding a policy with decent terms at a decent price.

Is it to make a "commission" or is to CYA for liability purposes??

I think all organizations need to do a better job of describing what is(and what is not) covered and how to report an injury. I would be willing to bet that the vast majority of TB players/parents out there are not even aware that some of their team fees have gone towards insurance

Actually most of the coaches I know think their ASA fee is largely to buy insurance. They are not sure what else they get from ASA, since they pay $400 for tournaments.

I did not say Coaches- I said players/parents

Where did you find the 50% fee/kick-back number?(just asking)

[jonriv]

I know here in CT the referral limit is $15 per referral- I guess that is 50% if they do it by player(and not team) Not sure why any insurance company would do that- the numbers do not seem to work(even if you don't pay claims) if you take into account reserve requirements and admin costs

[ontheblack]

I know here in CT the referral limit is $15 per referral- I guess that is 50% if they do it by player(and not team) Not sure why any insurance company would do that- the numbers do not seem to work(even if you don't pay claims) if you take into account reserve requirements and admin costs

Reserve requirements are easy when you dont pay out.

[PDad]

ASA is not charging $30+ for insurance. ASA registration fees vary by local association because they determine how much they're going to charge beyond the cost of the insurance. Here is a small sampling of various fees for individual JO player registration with the minimum coverage ($250 deductible):

- Alabama: w/o photo ID $15.50; w/ photo ID $20.50 (Note: $125 deductible is an extra $10)

- North Carolina: $17 (incl. photo ID)

- SoCal: $20 (incl. photo ID)

[jonriv]

ASA is not charging $30+ for insurance. ASA registration fees vary by local association because they determine how much they're going to charge beyond the cost of the insurance. Here is a small sampling of various fees for individual JO player registration with the minimum coverage ($250 deductible):

- Alabama: w/o photo ID $15.50; w/ photo ID $20.50 (Note: $125 deductible is an extra $10)

- North Carolina: $17 (incl. photo ID)

- SoCal: $20 (incl. photo ID)

So where is the "kickback?"