Follow
Donate to HeyBucket.com - Amount:

Welcome Anonymous !

Your Fastpitch Softball Bible
 

Premier Girls Fastpitch

PGF - Do it right or dont do it at all (10U)

Questions and discussions involving PGF

by Mr. Observation » Fri Dec 12, 2014 6:13 pm

I heard that PGF is adding a 10U division this year? My DD is too old for this to matter for her but I do have a God daughter in 8U. If PGF adds a 10U division with no qualifiers and invites only, there is no way whoever wins it can claim to be a national champion? This is nothing more then the greedy getting greedier. I am a big supporter of PGF 14-18U doing what it did to bring the best teams together to play in front of the scouts and crown a national champion. This however is a bad idea. PGF can not claim to know the best 32 teams in 10U nation wide? At the 10U division anything can happen! My DD plays 18U for a top organization and just the other day we were both saying that so far, our best memories of the game came back in the 8U-10U all star games. We loved the excitement of getting through district, through states and finaly making it to play on local TV at the 10U "B" westerns national championship. The majority of the girls on that team that still play ball will go on to play college softball even though they played rec in 10U. My DD went on to play in ASA "A', TCS and PGF national championships but 10U was the most fun! 10U it is the last season to have fun in softball before it turns into a recruiting business. In the fall of my DD's 10U season we played on a T shirt team that beat many of the top travel ball teams and we still decided to go back to rec. It turned out to be a good decision. My point being, not all the best teams in 10U play on travel ball teams. With no qualifiers the teams that pay the big$ to wear a big name on the front of thier shirts will be rewarded and the teams that play rec or on a T shirt team (that want to learn fundamentals and mechanics without being foolish enough to believe that their DD will be scouted to college in 10U on a top organization) will be left out. If PGF makes this a invite only then the top organization coaches will take the invites to save money and have a chance to claim a watered down national championship coaches title (then the can start charging ridiculous dues amounts, BS fundraisers and carry 20 on a team to make them 1-200,000$ a year, you big time coaches know who you are).

PGF- do the right thing by adding qualifiers or pull out of the 10U PGF division all together. The less choices the 10U division has the better chance it has to put the best teams in one spot. ASA is doing the right thing by adding a select division to allow the better talent in 10U-12U to play more competively with each other however its about 5 years too late. The rules for select will be a headache to apply but it is necessary IMO. A lot of people are saying that ASA is just rushing into this select thing but that is the same thing PGF is doing with a 10U national championship. PGF, keep your product supperior and do not make a 10U PGF national championship equivalent to a glorified toys for tots tournament. The game of 10U softball is obviously changing but PGF should do its part to change it for the better of the sport not to better someones wallet. Do not add a 10U division to PGF to pull talent away from ASA "A', "B" or TCS out of greed$. The devil is usually in the details and in this case the fact that you would claim to have a 10U national championship with no qualifiers is a huge detail. Do it right or don't do it at all. Just my observation.
Mr. Observation
 
Posts: 22
Joined: Tue Mar 08, 2011 11:32 pm

by PDad » Fri Dec 12, 2014 9:59 pm

OP doesn't seem to realize the 10U market is very small and extremely few teams will travel much. ASA/USA 10U Nationals only draw around 45 teams and only 5-6 teams from CA have been making the trip. Pretty much any 10U team can get a berth, but most won't even travel to a neighboring state for a 6-7 day national.

I suspect PGF isn't running qualifiers for 10U because there wouldn't be enough teams to make them viable.
User avatar
PDad
Premium Member
Premium Member
 
Posts: 3439
Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2009 4:52 pm

by PDad » Sat Dec 13, 2014 1:35 pm

Spazsdad wrote:
PDad wrote:Pretty much any 10U team can get a berth, but most won't even travel to a neighboring state for a 6-7 day national.

Maybe it has changed but there were always teams from all over the country at 10u Nats. Those teams all traveled from somewhere.

I didn't say none travel because obviously some do. It's undeniable the number and diversity of teams decreases as you go down the age groups.

Last year, 10U Nats in TN had 44 teams from 14 states (11 from GA) while 12U in IN had 73 teams from 21 states (11 GA & 10 IL).

In 2006, 10U Nats in Moline had 52 teams from 14 states (15 from IL) while 12U in Midland had 75 teams from 26 states (22 from CA).

In 2005, 10U Nats in TN had 42 teams from 15 states (11 CA) while 12U in CO had 92 teams from 25 states (22 from CA).
User avatar
PDad
Premium Member
Premium Member
 
Posts: 3439
Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2009 4:52 pm

by Mr. Observation » Tue Dec 16, 2014 12:00 am

In 10U teams from Texas are coming to play weekend tournaments in so cal and nor cal teams play in so cal on a regular basis for friendlies each weekend. P dad, if 5-6 so cal teams went to a hell whole in July/August for ASA, how many other teams out of state would come to Huntington Beach in late July? More then 32 is a guarantee. What you don't understand is that 10U softball is more skilled then when you were around. More $ into private lessons is being spent now then ever. The competition is just better at 10U now. PGF would easily be able to have qualifiers filled even if it was just PGF westerns for 10U. The fact is they would have to spend money on the qualifiers and they just want to profit on the "PGF national championship" name (that is a joke with no qualifiers). It is a way for PGF to take away some talented teams from their competition and still profit money without doing any work. I know they can do whatever they want but when they first started it was to better the game of softball. It's funny how $ can change things quickly. This is a forum that used to be informative and entertaining. $ has changed the bucket as well but I believe it was it for the better of the overall softball community. But dang it's boring now! Bring back the days when the bucket used the scoreboard and parents were proud to be nuts on the region. PGF can not claim to be doing the same by an invite only national championship. But they can do as they please and you can agree or disagree and so can I.
Mr. Observation
 
Posts: 22
Joined: Tue Mar 08, 2011 11:32 pm

by PDad » Tue Dec 16, 2014 11:43 am

The 2 TX 10U teams that came out here recently were an anomaly, just like the OH 12U team that came out here 4 years ago. It rarely happens at those age groups because there isn't the draw of college recruiting.

PGF struggled starting each of the younger age groups - lots of qualifiers were cancelled due to a lack of interest. A quick scan of last year's 12U results shows they still have a lot of work there to draw all the best 12U teams from the east like they do at the older age groups.

PGF will extend invitations to all the usual orgs and I expect they'll also end up taking just about any other team from outside CA/AZ that shows interest in coming. IMO, the only place(s) a qualifier would have an impact is SoCal and possibly NorCal.
User avatar
PDad
Premium Member
Premium Member
 
Posts: 3439
Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2009 4:52 pm

by catcherzrule » Tue Dec 16, 2014 2:31 pm

Mr. Diatribe...I mean Observation,

You said you don't have a DD playing in 10U, so just concern yourself with 18's, and enjoy that.

10's is very different...I have a DD in 18's AND one in 10's. 10U parents, myself included, would not travel even more than we already do to qualify for PGF 10U. ASA in Normal, IL was our goal until PGF made its announcement. We can play quality teams that the board of PGF will seek out and invite. TCS in Utah is the being attended by many 10's from across the country and is not the same week as PGF. The girls who attend TCS will get the "travel" experience and for those who are fortunate to be invited to PGF will get to experience all the great things that PGF has to offer as well.

Please, if it bothers you that much, haul yourself out to Illinois, get bitten savagely by abnormally large insects, sweat buckets and watch sub-par softball. PGF began because people were tired of having the "experience" I just described....awe the "good" ole days? I think not. :roll:

I applaud PGF and its board for allowing the 10's to experience the best of the best.
catcherzrule
 
Posts: 109
Joined: Fri Aug 17, 2012 1:27 pm

by Fastpitch4Life » Tue Dec 16, 2014 5:06 pm

DD's team did 10U ASA Nationals and 12U PGF Nationals twice. She would tell you that she had much more fun in 10U traveling 2000 miles and spending a week in a mediocre hotel with 11 of her best friends just being a kid. I'm glad we did it both ways, because there's no going back. There's plenty of time to play the "best of the best."
"I learned the path to Heaven is full of sinners and believers,
learned that happiness on earth ain't just for high achievers."
User avatar
Fastpitch4Life
Premium Member
Premium Member
 
Posts: 729
Joined: Wed Sep 01, 2010 12:24 pm

by Battle » Tue Dec 16, 2014 5:15 pm

catcherzrule wrote: Please, if it bothers you that much, haul yourself out to Illinois, get bitten savagely by abnormally large insects, sweat buckets and watch sub-par softball. PGF began because people were tired of having the "experience" I just described....awe the "good" ole days? I think not. :roll:

I'm sure ASA is just as glad to get rid of you as you are of them. Now everybody is happy.
We herd sheep, we drive cattle, we lead people. Lead me, follow me, or get out of my way!
User avatar
Battle
 
Posts: 1631
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2010 10:40 am

by 562Dad » Tue Dec 16, 2014 5:32 pm

While agree that in 10u traveling with your team and staying a week together is a great experience. This gives some 10u teams the opertunity to play both TCS ( in Utah) and PGF in Southern California. With a week off between. To me that's a no brainer. Prior to PGF announcing a National championship the Southern California teams only options where TCS in Utah or ASA in Normal Illinois traveling to only 1 is financially possible. Now playing in Utah and Southern California is a strong possibility. It hasn't been announced yet if PGF is offering a 12u birth for premier to the winner of 10u. If that does become a reality, I can't see the top 10u teams turning down an opertunity to play for that. However it will be interesting how and who gets the invite. I also applaud PGF for giving the 10u an opertunity to play for a title.
562Dad
 
Posts: 10
Joined: Thu Oct 31, 2013 9:57 am

by catcherzrule » Wed Dec 17, 2014 10:15 am

Battle...

OUCH... :lol:

Thanks for adding your insight to this thread...now everyone is enlightened! :o
catcherzrule
 
Posts: 109
Joined: Fri Aug 17, 2012 1:27 pm

Next

Return to Premier Girls Fastpitch