PGF 2011 - Review and Discussion

[MavFan]

Cal Lite also beat TX Glory, to force the if game in the semi's....[/quote

And then what happened?....

TX Glory SMOKED Cal Lite 6 - 5.
You said that no other teams besides Firecrackers beat TX Glory at PGF, when in fact Cal Lite beat them as well.

That's a very good point and you are correct. I was speaking more of the final finish than actual games but that is my fault. I should have been more clear. Of course someone beat them at one point. So you do agree that Glory and Lite were fairly evenly matched?

Battle if you really want to cause a stir....refer fastpitchmom21 to the thread where people were discussing how Cal Lite brought down some of their 18U team to play in 16U nationals.

That outta keep this thread going for another page or two. ha ha ha ha

[anonlooker]

Cal Lite also beat TX Glory, to force the if game in the semi's....[/quote

And then what happened?....

TX Glory SMOKED Cal Lite 6 - 5.
You said that no other teams besides Firecrackers beat TX Glory at PGF, when in fact Cal Lite beat them as well.

That's a very good point and you are correct. I was speaking more of the final finish than actual games but that is my fault. I should have been more clear. Of course someone beat them at one point. So you do agree that Glory and Lite were fairly evenly matched?

On that week they were. You seem to be looking to predicate your "ASA had better competition" on your opinion of Glory, and how they finished at PGF. But since you are already biased toward ASA, no one expects any of your opinions to be unbiased.

In the end, which tournament was "better" is highly subjective, and your opinion is no more or less valid than mine or that of anyone else.

IOW, there is no correct answer for everyone, only what was better for each player/team/family. PGF worked for us, and many others, so why does that seem to bother you so much? We know you liked that ASA tournament, and that's great, but why belabor the point? You can't prove one tournament or the other was better. You simply can't, because what was better for you wasn't better for us, and vice versa. There's really nothing more to it.

[anonlooker]

Let me add this - this thread is a review and discussion of PGF 2011.

If you would like to review and discuss ASA 2011, I'm sure no one will mind if you start a thread on that topic.

Since you weren't at PGF, your opinion has no relevance here.

[Fifteen's]

Battle, which of the SoCal teams that played PGF did your DD play in 2011?

None...How many of the top ASA teams did your DD play in 2011? I don't know what this will prove, but I guess I will see.

I'm gonna try and show you my point, one more time, and then I'm done. You, or your DD, have not played or seen these So Cal teams. Yet, you come on here and make statements and ASSumptions on how PGF is a "Western Nats". Well, My DD has played one of your teams on your list AND I watched most of the others at ASA, play. She has played most of the High Lighted So Cal teams and the ones she has not, I have watched play. PGF had, by far, the stiffest competition. I am saying that while my DD attended ASA in Chattanooga. Yet, I would not come on here and make ridiculous statements that ASA was an "Eastern Nats", but an argument could be made for that before one for PGF being a "Western Nats".

Please explain to me one thing. Just exactly how you have proven your assumptions and opinions? I am still at a loss to read it anywhere in this post. With not playing the teams at PGF or even seeing them in action, how does one come up with the Hyperbole you come up with that PGF is a "Western Nats"? If it is a Biased opinion, that's fine. Just don't call them "proven" facts.

[Fifteen's]

Let me add this - this thread is a review and discussion of PGF 2011.

If you would like to review and discuss ASA 2011, I'm sure no one will mind if you start a thread on that topic.

Since you weren't at PGF, your opinion has no relevance here.

I'll end with this...............BINGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Battle]

On that week they were. You seem to be looking to predicate your "ASA had better competition" on your opinion of Glory, and how they finished at PGF. But since you are already biased toward ASA, no one expects any of your opinions to be unbiased.

In the end, which tournament was "better" is highly subjective, and your opinion is no more or less valid than mine or that of anyone else.

IOW, there is no correct answer for everyone, only what was better for each player/team/family. PGF worked for us, and many others, so why does that seem to bother you so much? We know you liked that ASA tournament, and that's great, but why belabor the point? You can't prove one tournament or the other was better. You simply can't, because what was better for you wasn't better for us, and vice versa. There's really nothing more to it.

Ok...So the next time there is a post promoting PGF over ASA on the basis of competition, I expect that you will jump right in and explain this the same way you explained it to me. Right?

[Battle]

Let me add this - this thread is a review and discussion of PGF 2011.

If you would like to review and discuss ASA 2011, I'm sure no one will mind if you start a thread on that topic.

Since you weren't at PGF, your opinion has no relevance here.

I'm glad you put it that way because I will expect that everytime you post, you will stay on the subject at hand.

[Battle]

Battle, which of the SoCal teams that played PGF did your DD play in 2011?

None...How many of the top ASA teams did your DD play in 2011? I don't know what this will prove, but I guess I will see.

I'm gonna try and show you my point, one more time, and then I'm done. You, or your DD, have not played or seen these So Cal teams. Yet, you come on here and make statements and ASSumptions on how PGF is a "Western Nats". Well, My DD has played one of your teams on your list AND I watched most of the others at ASA, play. She has played most of the High Lighted So Cal teams and the ones she has not, I have watched play. PGF had, by far, the stiffest competition. I am saying that while my DD attended ASA in Chattanooga. Yet, I would not come on here and make ridiculous statements that ASA was an "Eastern Nats", but an argument could be made for that before one for PGF being a "Western Nats".

Please explain to me one thing. Just exactly how you have proven your assumptions and opinions? I am still at a loss to read it anywhere in this post. With not playing the teams at PGF or even seeing them in action, how does one come up with the Hyperbole you come up with that PGF is a "Western Nats"? If it is a Biased opinion, that's fine. Just don't call them "proven" facts.

I have showed you with a qualifier and 2 Nats what my forms my opinion and you have showed me nothing but speculation. I don't have to see the teams to know that one team beat every team but one in a national and couldn't beat the #9 team in the other national. Either you can't read or just don't want to. Show me something other than speculation that drives your opinion...You can't so you are right...You are done.

Now at the request of Anonlooker, back to "PGF 2011-Review and Discussion" Carry on...

[dirtlover]

2011 PGF review, Battle, Battle, Battle. You can spew all the "We played so and so and you didn't" that you want but if you have half the brain you claim to have you know very well that any team can win any day. I know you have sat around the park scratching your head wondering how the hell your kids team just lost to that nobody team. We all have. ASA or PGF is a choice and we all have our opinions but until your team or the teams you say would win out here come and try I guess you will just be blowing hot air. I would venture to say it would be the toughest western nats you've ever attended. But then again all those teams from the east side would probably just roll out here, right? Okee Dokee...

[PDad]

These teams would have had to get by all these teams to do it and I just don't think it would have happened----Oklahoma Force '94, Sneaky Cleats Springer, Texas Bombers – White, Southern Force – Thomas, Lasers Scarlett - Columbus, OH

OK Force '94? They were knocked into the losers bracket 0-11 by a solid SoCal team that was not highly rated and almost all 96s. I think the higher-rated PGF teams would have fared well against them too.

Even if they would have beat the 1st three, the last 2 listed was bad a$$. Especially the Lasers. Once they got to the loser bracket, it was as if they were on a mission.

The Lasers made a commendable run through the losers bracket, but they didn't face much competition down there. Name a strong team they beat.

You can't determine the relative strength of teams strictly on the final order of finish. Cases in point:
- CA Cruisers beat OK Force '94 11-0, yet they finished lower (17th and 9th resepectively).
- Texas Glory finished 2nd in PGF while only going 2-2 against the ranked SoCal teams - and they didn't have to face them before the winners bracket final. The 2-2 record only puts them even with the ranked teams.

I'm not saying PGF was definitely stronger than ASA - they both had strong teams. I'm just saying you can't rate ASA as having a better field of teams.