Snow Paralyzes The Northeast !

[jonriv]

I justify the expense because the company suggests I utilize it and time is imprtant to them- generally speaking if it is just me speed is not as important. I am no liberal and as mentioned before, I work in finance. Many of my colleagues fly, I take the train because it is faster and saves money

As far as California rail- I am quite aware of the increase in Amtrak California nd the California cars, a more local version of the Superliner cars. I also know that capital corridor has done well, as well as an increase in what was the San Diegans(formerly Sante Fe) The Caltran commuter service in San Fran and the success of the "Baby Bullet" service.

If any place is in dire need of mass transit and rail-it's California There is no more room for roads, no room to expand airports.

As far as trains through camp pendelton- the San Diego rail service goes through there already- no?

[PDad]

I justify the expense because the company suggests I utilize it and time is imprtant to them- generally speaking if it is just me speed is not as important. I am no liberal and as mentioned before, I work in finance. Many of my colleagues fly, I take the train because it is faster and saves money
The fact is you can't justify the additional expense when you're paying for it and that renders all your obfuscation and rationalization irrelevant,

As far as California rail- I am quite aware of the increase in Amtrak California nd the California cars, a more local version of the Superliner cars. I also know that capital corridor has done well, as well as an increase in what was the San Diegans(formerly Sante Fe) The Caltran commuter service in San Fran and the success of the "Baby Bullet" service.
You're still missing a ton of the heavy and light rail. Google some more...

If any place is in dire need of mass transit and rail-it's California There is no more room for roads, no room to expand airports.
As Spazsdad posted, a ton of money has been invested in mass transit and, unfortunately, to subsidize it's operation. It is ridiculous to suggest more without a user base that makes it viable to operate on it's own. We have expanded airports when necessary and, as previously posted, rail can't compete with planes for longer trips,

As far as trains through camp pendelton- the San Diego rail service goes through there already- no?

Yes they do, but not at 150-200 MPH. I've traveled on that route and it needs a lot more than faster trains. The reason it hasn't been done is increasing the speed through that portion wouldn't result in much of a reduction in the overall time.

[jonriv]

The Acela is designed for business traffic- I have used it for personal(yes on my own dime) when time was important. Also have taken it to Washington DC Find myself of regionals mostly because the Acela does not stop in Westerly, RI where my family has a house. Take from that what you will.

I nver really suggested 150 mph through Pendelton- just felt that that route could use 100mph plus travel like it did in the 1960's with the sante Fe(before FRA restrictions) That route could use more frequent service and faster trains IMO

I am very aware of the LA Subway & Light rail- as well as the very successful tijuana trolly in San Diego Should I add Metro rail & Coaster service- perhaps the San Joquims-- did I forget BART?

All very nice, but a drop in the bucket compared to the Northeast

I agree that Planes are much better for longer distance Generally anything under 4 hours tends to make more sense by train. The LA to San Fran is less than Boston to DC. Similar to Paris-Berlin London-Amsterdam

The more people you move from Planes to Trains- it opens up more airport slots for the longer, more efficient flights

Similarly- the more people that can take mass transit- the more space it opens on the roads for those that can not use it

[Safebyahare]

Some people refuse to subsidize high speed rail.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g4Au3WLpjTg

I prefer an old train, me in doorway 2000.http://lib.store.yahoo.net/lib/pentrex/UP3985-11.jpg

[PDad]

The Acela is designed for business traffic- I have used it for personal(yes on my own dime) when time was important. Also have taken it to Washington DC Find myself of regionals mostly because the Acela does not stop in Westerly, RI where my family has a house. Take from that what you will.
I expect Acela's schedule slot had more to do with time savings than the 20-30 minute difference in travel time. I doubt you'd choose to pay 64% more if there was a Regional train that similarly met your schedule requirements.

I nver really suggested 150 mph through Pendelton- just felt that that route could use 100mph plus travel like it did in the 1960's with the sante Fe(before FRA restrictions) That route could use more frequent service and faster trains IMO
My bad - you suggested HSR in less developed areas and cited examples of 150-200 MPH trains. What is the ROI for making the improvements necessary for 100+MPH travel? That route has fairly frequent service and there is quite a bit of traffic on it between the different passenger services and freight trains - what's the ROI on increasing capacity for more frequent service?

I am very aware of the LA Subway & Light rail- as well as the very successful tijuana trolly in San Diego Should I add Metro rail & Coaster service- perhaps the San Joquims-- did I forget BART?
You either missed Metrolink or didn't realize it's different than Metro Rail. You're just regurgitating what you googled...

All very nice, but a drop in the bucket compared to the Northeast
We also don't have the population density of the Northeast.

I agree that Planes are much better for longer distance Generally anything under 4 hours tends to make more sense by train. I presume you mean 4-hours by train. Time wise, it varies by proximity of airports, so it could be as low as 2-1/2 hours (we have more airports here). Cost wise, air fares vary greatly depending on air passenger volume, competition and how far in advance you can buy tickets.

The LA to San Fran is less than Boston to DC. Wrong - the planned LA-SF route is 490-520 miles and Acela is 454 miles. I seriously doubt they'll get the LA-SF trip under 3 hours and air fares can be dirt cheap on that route. Similar to Paris-Berlin London-Amsterdam I don't f'g care...

The more people you move from Planes to Trains- it opens up more airport slots for the longer, more efficient flights
So, you're advocating using taxpayer money to disrupt the airline industry - like they don't have enough problems already. Airport slots go to the flights that generate the most money - unless you're going to legislate against that too.

Similarly- the more people that can take mass transit- the more space it opens on the roads for those that can not use it

There's more mass transit in place than riders to support it. They adjust routes, capacity and schedules based on volume. I guess they need someone like you to show them how to do it properly. Please tell us, omniscient one, precisely what they need to do differently.

[PDad]

Off topic: Worked for railroad for over 25yrs.
Best cup of coffee, running a train up Cajon pass during winter. (btw the front seat is the best seat)
Conductor breaks out with a cappacino maker with frother that works on little camping stove thing.
Must have been 3am, and snowing. A good cup.
Sounds good

On topic,,,CA should have been looking at a way to bring more water to state. Not a choo choo to Nor. Cal.

Ding! Ding! Ding! We have a winner! Give the man a chicken dinner.

[PDad]

Some people refuse to subsidize high speed rail.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g4Au3WLpjTg

I prefer an old train, me in doorway 2000.http://lib.store.yahoo.net/lib/pentrex/UP3985-11.jpg

Crazy video... Where was your picture taken?

I had a buddy in college from Bakersfield that worked on the railroad as a brakeman. He'd make a couple weekend trips a month and studied in the caboose while they were traveling. It was back in the 70's and it worked out well for him.

[jonriv]

The more people you move from Planes to Trains- it opens up more airport slots for the longer, more efficient flights
So, you're advocating using taxpayer money to disrupt the airline industry - like they don't have enough problems already. Airport slots go to the flights that generate the most money - unless you're going to legislate against that too.

Not disrupting-there is a finite number of slots -the number of flights needed will increase, freeing up slots from short haul to long haul(generally more profitable) will benefit airlines. It has already happened on the East Coast and in Europe

As for my trying to remember all rail service in California, it comes mostly from trying to recall from years of reading Trains magazine and a life long love of trains

Look- I think the HSR initiative in Cali has been a disaster- as mentioned before it over-reached and over promised. It has also been mismanaged. Having rode HSR throughout Europe(and seeing what has been done in Japan and China) We as a country should be embarassed. If you have never ridden HSR-try it. Even the Acela, with its flaws have been a hit.

[PDad]

Not disrupting-there is a finite number of slots -the number of flights needed will increase, freeing up slots from short haul to long haul(generally more profitable) will benefit airlines. It has already happened on the East Coast and in Europe

We have more airports with major carriers around LA-OC-IE (5) and SF (3), so we're not really constrained by slots like most of the cities back east that only have 1 airport (some have 2). The airlines optimize their efficiency and use of their slots via the hub-and-spoke model.

Look- I think the HSR initiative in Cali has been a disaster- as mentioned before it over-reached and over promised. It has also been mismanaged. Umm, the current 2012 Business Plan has them building it in segments so it provides benefits earlier and builds ridership... It's a huge government project, so overreach, over-promise and mismanagement are a given - look what happened with the Heathcare.gov website.

Having rode HSR throughout Europe(and seeing what has been done in Japan and China) We as a country should be embarassed. If you have never ridden HSR-try it. Even the Acela, with its flaws have been a hit.

I'm not categorically opposed to HSR - I'll use it and support it where it makes sense. I am opposed to inventing applications of it just to satisfy a perceived need without proper justification. They never would have gotten the HSR proposition passed here if they hadn't over-promised its benefit (3 hr LA-SF) and underestimated its cost.

[Safebyahare]

PDad,,Have no idea who took shot, going west near summit of Cajon Pass.(found it on web)
Just know which private and party trains I've been on. That was a steam train going to DNC in LA 2000.
Party trains are private cars on the end of amtrak, (booze and food don't stop)
Example http://www.vcrail.com/virginia_city.htm

Sorry for side tracking this thread.. You on the east coast may return to freezing temps.