Is Early Recruiting Right or Wrong? Kidz "n" Sports

[fastpitchdad05]

Congrats on the opportunity for your daughter, but what would be the difference if it were two year later?

Would also be willing to give updates through the process( bad as well as good)

In today's climate $$ would be soaked up and our family would be financially tougher place. Of course most of her offers have said they will wait as long as needed. A few committing on waiting until NLA day. When opportunity knocks and is exactly a fit why wait.

I don't want to hear well what if... Come at me that way if you can walk in the same shoes. It just isn't that easy.

I'd love to contribute on her process... Issue is it a very competitive environment and there are a ton of politics. It truly is a business on both side and it's sad. I can say I feel that why so many DD's might commit early cause the pressure is there. So until she ultimately decides I will wait. Oh and no comments regarding pressure cause that doesn't change no matter the age. Been through that too!

33, I think he meant waiting 2 years if the rules were changed. You wouldn't have to worry about losing the money that way, all the money for your 2019 grad would still be there for her NLI.

BTW congrats to your son on a successful first year in the minors. I will definitely be following his progress and rooting for him.

[as the world turns]

I am beginning to think this guy's story is bull. He is trying to pull everyone's chains, I am not buying it.

[rbi]

First time i really looked at this thread and have mixed feelings on this topic.. A lot of this has to do with the child and how mature she is and how she handles the pressure of early committing, because the pressure will be there to perform more so now than when you were still on the "open market". Pressure from your parents, coaches and future coaches, as well as self induced pressure. How you handle this as a 15/16/17yr old is HUGE and so important. This goes for the classroom as well, you can't get back that "easy" freshman year that should allow most hard working kids to ace all the classes to get that good jump start, even if your taking the pre AP or Honors or whatever your neck of the woods calls it because, the remaining years get tougher and tougher.

I also feel like and SEE and HEAR a lot of parents putting added pressure on their kids, after the early verbal. With the rise in social media now days, some parents feel the need to post stuff daily about Suzy and her accomplishments, and you know what I'm really proud of my kids and yes i will put a highlight or two on my kids great plays or home runs on social media but, dammit when you post daily and put these high expectations on your kid, and all she really wants to do is be a "kid" right now, it just adds to the pressure, sometimes to the breaking point. When you walk around and all you do is talk about your kid, it gets to the point where people talk about YOU and try to avoid you at all cost because they get sick of hearing it. This goes for the local all star to the top of the food chain (National team members), it has no boundaries .. I remember one coach telling me years ago and it stuck with me, its better to hear someone talk positivilty about your kid than to listen to yourself, and i totally agree. When someone tells me , "hey i saw your kid hit a home run in the world series", i reply back, yea she finally got into one… Now deep down inside I'm super proud but I'm not going to stand their and go on and on about how great my kid is.

My point is, hopefully your kid is mature enough to handle the pressure because, there will be pressure for sure. Hopefully the parents are there to guide her along the way, as these kids need that big time. They need it when choosing a place to live and go to school for next 4 or 5 years, they need it in their daily lives going thru HS, they need it to handle the star QB on the HS team who is trying to get more time with your DD but she is too busy… They need to handle the daily jealously issues that will be there for sure. They will need it while away at college for sure as well. Sometimes as parents we create this "animal", and it backfires on us, and we spend a lot of our time trying to harness our kid back in when she feels like she is better than anyone and has a hard time daily taking direction from parents/adults/teachers/coachs etc… and it can be very dangerous. Every kid is different and every family is different and there is no perfect recipe on this, just be there for your kids and try and be humble, as the late great John Wooden said, and i will leave you all with this,

"Talent is God given. Be humble. Fame is man-given. Be grateful. Conceit is self-given. Be careful"

[CoachMike]

Subject: Is Early Recruiting Right or Wrong? Kidz "n" Sports

OMG...The end is near...I agree with both Sam and JoanRivers...

And for the record, nobody is taking anything away from any kid...
Just slowing down the jets some.

Some really 'odd' comments on here about 14yr old rights...
The ONLY 'rights' a 14yr old has at my house as far as my kid
The right to safe home, food on the table, a warm place to sleep, clothes, parental discipline and affection....education etc
And at my house religious values are taught...not forced mind you...taught!

Not tattoos, not odd piercings of body parts....not using the f-bomb every other word..
IMHO if your using an abortion as a right for a 14yr old you are total failure at being a parent in the 1st place.

Man you spun and twisted words... I suggest you re-read!

The entire idea of what I'm am bringing to the table is about choice and the right to have it. Almost posters here seem to feel because in the past there were a few sad stories and/or wrong choices by young recruits. So they feel it is only right to delay opportunity and choice for all DD.

My point is why? My point is why delay the process for a handful of DD's because even fewer (like a lot fewer now!) didn't see the outcome they hoped for happen. That's my sour grapes issue with the poster BTW...

That being said, those same posters suggest all DD's are simply to young to make a choice for their future and just can't possibly ever ever ever know what they could want for their future. Just isn't possible... Right! So I injected the even more dreadful decision of right to life choice far more 14 year old DD make throughout our country. This has far greater (like severe people) harm to their future life, self confidence, marital status, potential health, social economic and God forbid spirtual well being. See the similarities in the two issues here now?

Oh and for the record PR I don't condone or approve right to take life. If you notice I won't even use that word cause it is ugly and shamefull in my opinion.

End of the day 20-30 young ladies have the opportunity each year to commit during 8th grade or just after. In 9th grade that number grows to 150 or so... BTW, JR those girls aren't going to your North Eastern/New England area schools so this isn't your subject. They are committing to Top 10 softball programs and an occasional flier.

Someone asked what I suggest we do differently. I don't cause it's a family issue and I don't feel we should inject our views on any single family. Period! Though if pressed I would like to see some sort of a stronger value or legally binding placed on the verbal. Call it a soft letter of intent with a promise to commit to financial numbers from said University with a promise to perform with certain measurables for the DD. But that's just me, make everyone accountable!

Better than waiting in my view...

33 I must say, since you don't know me or have not talked with my, your sour grapes comment is so off base it's not even funny.

Second, this whole thread was meant for a discussion to get feedback on what the general thinking among the troops is. Thank you all for your posts.

Those of you that tried to point out that it is not just 20 or 30 players are absolutely correct. More than that, it is not even just about the kids who actually get to receive a verbal offer. It's about the thousands more players who's parents may be putting a lot of pressure on them to get the scholarship who may feel overwhelmed or worse. "Will you still love me if I strike out?"

33: I don't have a problem with any kid getting the opportunity. But when even some college coaches admit that it's getting out of hand we need to listen. The other factor that was barely touched on in comments, is that the physical (and mental) body changes a lot in those 4 years. How many players have you seen who were a great pitcher at 14 but when they turned 18 they were just another player?

Oh, and your players still have to take those SATs and depending on your kid and their makeup, they may worry about that too whether they need an 1800 score or a 2200 score.

Check out Changing The Game Project. http://changingthegameproject.com/release-your-child-to-the-game/?inf_contact_key=30b4e55ba8da3639f932819a02fd95c43bf1ffcb145ac9c837ddf42092a47632

What I want to see is that more kids want to play sports so that more kids can benefit from sports. And if your kid gets a scholarship, congratulations. But if they don't, do you think just as highly about them as you would if they did?

Hope you find some good grapes 33 because there aren't any grapes around here, sour or otherwise.

[AlwaysImprove]

I am beginning to think this guy's story is bull. He is trying to pull everyone's chains, I am not buying it.

I think tbjd33 has done a good job of representing the upsides of early verbals. His comments are why I was not big on the initial petition to get NCAA to stop early verbals in softball. Furthermore, i felt NCAA would not understand how softball early verbals are different from other sports where early verbals seem to create advantage for the athlete.

tbjd33 is correct, in that early verbals, even with the flaws that happen in softball early verbals, has upside.

I think he is overlooking the pressure aspect of young kids worrying about college at too young of an age. The original NLI system was introduced for just this reason. Colleges have zero ability to help themselves going ever and ever younger. Parents have zero ability in grabbing that commitment, getting panicked, making bad decisions.

Yes, our family like tbjd33, did all my homework, and did all the visits we could. We passed on a HS freshman opportunity. And then had several freak out moments, until she got a great offer from a great school and great coaches, and could not be any happier. But there was intense pressure through that period.

It took a ton of discipline, but we felt making a bad decision would ultimately be worse, than ending up without any deal. Many other parents were no where near as good at it as we were. We also felt DD grades were good enough to go academic scholarship if softball ended up not working out. Not everyone has that flexibility.

College coaches, when weighing the risk of getting players that 5 years later fail to live up to expectations vs loosing out on top recruits. They know they can ditch players. So this will continue to push down to younger and younger ages.

The lack of flexibility in the 'verbals' in softball is a problem. This creates a one way NLI, where the college coach holds all the cards. It also removes a natural governor in the verbal process, If verballed players would start moving commitments based on better offers, that would slow the push to younger younger players. Knowing you have an 8th grader, and there is a reasonable chance she will change commits, makes that verbal commitment way more soft.

Current verballing system can be improved by treating verbals as what they are 'verbals'. NCAA should step in, and undo the collusion that creates the current system.

[tbjd33]

Subject: Is Early Recruiting Right or Wrong? Kidz "n" Sports

OMG...The end is near...I agree with both Sam and JoanRivers...

And for the record, nobody is taking anything away from any kid...
Just slowing down the jets some.

Some really 'odd' comments on here about 14yr old rights...
The ONLY 'rights' a 14yr old has at my house as far as my kid
The right to safe home, food on the table, a warm place to sleep, clothes, parental discipline and affection....education etc
And at my house religious values are taught...not forced mind you...taught!

Not tattoos, not odd piercings of body parts....not using the f-bomb every other word..
IMHO if your using an abortion as a right for a 14yr old you are total failure at being a parent in the 1st place.

Man you spun and twisted words... I suggest you re-read!

The entire idea of what I'm am bringing to the table is about choice and the right to have it. Almost posters here seem to feel because in the past there were a few sad stories and/or wrong choices by young recruits. So they feel it is only right to delay opportunity and choice for all DD.

My point is why? My point is why delay the process for a handful of DD's because even fewer (like a lot fewer now!) didn't see the outcome they hoped for happen. That's my sour grapes issue with the poster BTW...

That being said, those same posters suggest all DD's are simply to young to make a choice for their future and just can't possibly ever ever ever know what they could want for their future. Just isn't possible... Right! So I injected the even more dreadful decision of right to life choice far more 14 year old DD make throughout our country. This has far greater (like severe people) harm to their future life, self confidence, marital status, potential health, social economic and God forbid spirtual well being. See the similarities in the two issues here now?

Oh and for the record PR I don't condone or approve right to take life. If you notice I won't even use that word cause it is ugly and shamefull in my opinion.

End of the day 20-30 young ladies have the opportunity each year to commit during 8th grade or just after. In 9th grade that number grows to 150 or so... BTW, JR those girls aren't going to your North Eastern/New England area schools so this isn't your subject. They are committing to Top 10 softball programs and an occasional flier.

Someone asked what I suggest we do differently. I don't cause it's a family issue and I don't feel we should inject our views on any single family. Period! Though if pressed I would like to see some sort of a stronger value or legally binding placed on the verbal. Call it a soft letter of intent with a promise to commit to financial numbers from said University with a promise to perform with certain measurables for the DD. But that's just me, make everyone accountable!

Better than waiting in my view...

33 I must say, since you don't know me or have not talked with my, your sour grapes comment is so off base it's not even funny.

Second, this whole thread was meant for a discussion to get feedback on what the general thinking among the troops is. Thank you all for your posts.

Those of you that tried to point out that it is not just 20 or 30 players are absolutely correct. More than that, it is not even just about the kids who actually get to receive a verbal offer. It's about the thousands more players who's parents may be putting a lot of pressure on them to get the scholarship who may feel overwhelmed or worse. "Will you still love me if I strike out?"

33: I don't have a problem with any kid getting the opportunity. But when even some college coaches admit that it's getting out of hand we need to listen. The other factor that was barely touched on in comments, is that the physical (and mental) body changes a lot in those 4 years. How many players have you seen who were a great pitcher at 14 but when they turned 18 they were just another player?

Oh, and your players still have to take those SATs and depending on your kid and their makeup, they may worry about that too whether they need an 1800 score or a 2200 score.

Check out Changing The Game Project. http://changingthegameproject.com/release-your-child-to-the-game/?inf_contact_key=30b4e55ba8da3639f932819a02fd95c43bf1ffcb145ac9c837ddf42092a47632

What I want to see is that more kids want to play sports so that more kids can benefit from sports. And if your kid gets a scholarship, congratulations. But if they don't, do you think just as highly about them as you would if they did?

Hope you find some good grapes 33 because there aren't any grapes around here, sour or otherwise.

Coach Mike... This is not a personal issue and your right I don't know you. If you take comments personal on this tread I suggest you move to a different forum. With that being , said my comment of "sour grapes" wasn't direct at you directly more so at the proponents of the petition.

I use the term sour grapes cause a common theme I read are comments like, "they are different players by their JR year", "they aren't mature enough to decide" , "parents put to much pressure on their DD", and so on. To me my friend, those are sour grapes comments. Those are comments based purely on one person having something they wished their DD had. Remember this sport isnt for everyone and not everyone will get a full offer let alone any offer. People need to be ok with that concept. Yes you may drive, spend loads of time, loads of money and what ever else and your DD just might not get anything! That is the norm for most... No one is entitled to anything!

Here is a thought... I've heard on many occasions how many lower level D1, D2,D3 and NAIA schools don't even think of those younger DD's. Most saying they won't recruit seriously until summer going into JR year. Isn't that opportunity for those? Is that fair to the younger girls which might just want one of those schools? How is that ok? How's that not collusion amongst coaches which choose not to visit a 14u showcase?

The pressure will never change no matter the age or grade. As long as college dollars and opportunity is available!

[tbjd33]

I am beginning to think this guy's story is bull. He is trying to pull everyone's chains, I am not buying it.

I think tbjd33 has done a good job of representing the upsides of early verbals. His comments are why I was not big on the initial petition to get NCAA to stop early verbals in softball. Furthermore, i felt NCAA would not understand how softball early verbals are different from other sports where early verbals seem to create advantage for the athlete.

tbjd33 is correct, in that early verbals, even with the flaws that happen in softball early verbals, has upside.

I think he is overlooking the pressure aspect of young kids worrying about college at too young of an age. The original NLI system was introduced for just this reason. Colleges have zero ability to help themselves going ever and ever younger. Parents have zero ability in grabbing that commitment, getting panicked, making bad decisions.

Yes, our family like tbjd33, did all my homework, and did all the visits we could. We passed on a HS freshman opportunity. And then had several freak out moments, until she got a great offer from a great school and great coaches, and could not be any happier. But there was intense pressure through that period.

It took a ton of discipline, but we felt making a bad decision would ultimately be worse, than ending up without any deal. Many other parents were no where near as good at it as we were. We also felt DD grades were good enough to go academic scholarship if softball ended up not working out. Not everyone has that flexibility.

College coaches, when weighing the risk of getting players that 5 years later fail to live up to expectations vs loosing out on top recruits. They know they can ditch players. So this will continue to push down to younger and younger ages.

The lack of flexibility in the 'verbals' in softball is a problem. This creates a one way NLI, where the college coach holds all the cards. It also removes a natural governor in the verbal process, If verballed players would start moving commitments based on better offers, that would slow the push to younger younger players. Knowing you have an 8th grader, and there is a reasonable chance she will change commits, makes that verbal commitment way more soft.

Current verballing system can be improved by treating verbals as what they are 'verbals'. NCAA should step in, and undo the collusion that creates the current system.

AI I will concede to your point about collusion in the current system... But if a DD is content and her family also they why worry about other opportunities?

If a DD continues to work and stay on track there isn't goin to be an issue in the lions share of verbals. It is a very small number of DD that loose an offer because a coach found a better player elsewhere. Has it happened yes and will it happen in the future yes. That is part of this process and that will never change.

What we need to fight for more than changing the verbal system is MORE SCHOLERSHIPS...Softball is becoming a giant in media and sponsors. It is third only to football(of course) and men's basketball in viewer ship and sponsors. The viewing number during the WCWS was 2.5 times the CWS. Why not fight to make the number 18full guaranteed instead of 12 whatever they decide. Think about it, most college rosters hover around 18-20. Schools already pay travel, medical, and an assortment of cost related to that number. So what if they add 8 more scholerships. I know that gets pricey but that's not our issue. Now that is a great fight!

Just a thought...

Oh and World Turns. I'm for real here.

[PDad]

Here is a thought... I've heard on many occasions how many lower level D1, D2,D3 and NAIA schools don't even think of those younger DD's. Most saying they won't recruit seriously until summer going into JR year. Isn't that opportunity for those? (It may be the norm for most) Is that fair to the younger girls which might just want one of those schools? (Yes) How is that ok? (They can wait if that's what they really want) How's that not collusion amongst coaches which choose not to visit a 14u showcase?

It's a rational approach to the current situation because their typical recruits are not welcoming of their advances until the players realize they're not going to be recruited by a major D1.

You have hit upon the development I dislike the most, 14U showcases, because they help fuel the wide-spread mania of being recruited very early. The number of players recruited at that stage is very small and in the past they either played up on a strong 16U team or on an elite 14U team that was allowed into 16U showcases. I was dismayed when Surf City added 14U and put them on some of the main HB fields a couple years ago. I was heartened to see them moved to south OC last year.

The college coaches that are interested in the elite 14U players will go wherever they are playing, as evidenced a few years ago at an exclusive OCBB 14U "friendly" where I saw coaches from OK, OR, TN, UCLA and others. I prefer this under-the-radar approach over highly-publicized 14U showcases.

[PDad]

What we need to fight for more than changing the verbal system is MORE SCHOLERSHIPS...Softball is becoming a giant in media and sponsors. It is third only to football(of course) and men's basketball in viewer ship and sponsors. The viewing number during the WCWS was 2.5 times the CWS. Why not fight to make the number 18full guaranteed instead of 12 whatever they decide. Think about it, most college rosters hover around 18-20. Schools already pay travel, medical, and an assortment of cost related to that number. So what if they add 8 more scholerships. I know that gets pricey but that's not our issue. Now that is a great fight!

FTR, 18 - 12 would be 6 more scholarships...

[rbi]

If you think an offer has no time line because the staff told you that, I have some ice to sell you in Alaska.….. When you get that phone call a month after the offer, and staff says we are pulling offer, and you know your kid has done everything right up to the point, don't kid yourself that someone else didn't come along that they felt was more important to the program. So be real careful on that, and don't be afraid to ask those difficult questions, more importantly, COMMUNICATE, with the staff...DD most importantly as thats who they want to talk to more so than mom or dad…….


One thing you will not see on any social media, is Suzy's mom or dad telling the world that their child's offer was pulled, just doesn't happen, but it DOES happen, more so than people think. Its just that you don't hear about it, or parents come up with some big line as to why they are no longer wearing so and so's shirts anymore, and their childs social media doesn't include any photos of a certain schools colors…. So be carefu, sometimes when you think you have them in the palm of your hands u really don't ever have them at all, they own the cards, not you… They have a job to do and a career to protect…..

BTW, softball costs schools money, it is a NON revenue generating sport, someone can even post what it costs a school to operate a big time D-1 program, and how much revenue they bring in each year….