Follow
Donate to HeyBucket.com - Amount:

Welcome Anonymous !

Your Fastpitch Softball Bible
 

Fastpitch Discussions

6u/8u rec curriculum

What's on your mind?

by artomatic » Thu Oct 28, 2010 4:19 pm

Been out of our local league since 2006.
It is a very competitive league, similar to about 5-6 other local leagues in socal - Orange/LA counties.

A few things our league did and most likely still does that I think really helped:

1) coaches were required to attend an ACE clinic each year before the season started..
Ok, so it isn't rocket science, and Candrea didn't speak, but it provided alot of great ideas for beginners, and the book they passed out was full of beginner drills and suggestions.

2) the league hired and paid a local pitching coach to give free lessons to the league players on Sundays.
teams in each age division could send up to 4 girls in their time frame.
example: 8u from 9am to 9:30am, 10U from 9:30am to 10am, and so on.
each player had to provide a parent to catch, or a catcher in the older divisions.
It really helped the girls learn the basic fundamentals for free.

3) hired local travel teams or a local college to give a one day clinic before the season started.
The league chharged a modest fee (I think around $20 per player which included a lunch).
the girls loved it and it gave local travel teams a chance to fundraise.
My first travel team put one on, and in return we were allowed to use the league's fields/cages.
Of course this one always has those against having any kind of relationship with travel teams, Unfortunately, there will always be those with that point of view.
I remember one complaint from an anti-travel parent on the board: "the travel girls hit the ball too hard and will damage the batting cage fence." :D

***Or you could have free batting practices nightly in your backyard batting cage for your neighbor***
:twisted: :twisted: :twisted:
Deserve's got nothin' to do with it.
User avatar
artomatic
Premium Member
Premium Member
 
Posts: 2802
Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2007 10:41 pm
Location: Nearest Ogggi's

by Momo's Dad » Fri Oct 29, 2010 9:50 am

Thanks, Artomatic.

Although I can't say for certain, I believe we require the ACE certification for 8u and above coaches. Most of the 6u coaches are softball people who do a good job teaching, but the game structure isn't conducive to reinforcing what the kids are learning in practice.

I love the idea of hiring a pitching coach for group lessons. I'm not saying the world needs to be fair or that we should be striving for a (more) socialist society, but purely in the interest of sport, I'm not sure what we gain by limiting the opportunity to pitch to girls whose parents can afford $70/hour private lessons. This is something I'd even be willing to sponsor myself.

There's a chance one of the local colleges may help with a preseason clinic, but even if not, we should still invite girls and parents out prior to the start of the season, as a number of girls arrive at their first t-ball practice with gloves that have never been used before. It's my experience that many girls seem to love playing catch with Dad, so it's surprising when so few have actually done much of it before heading to practice for the first time. No date has been set, but we're looking at possibly a mid-January date, which would also be a good time for walk-up registration. We typically do player evaluation day in early-mid February for 8u and older.

I hope we can integrate some of your suggestions right away.
Momo's Dad
 
Posts: 103
Joined: Mon Oct 04, 2010 12:12 pm

by 1bzymom » Fri Oct 29, 2010 10:24 am

My 16 year old could have been one of those "I quit" at 13 but I did not allow her. I made her sign up for Spring rec because I knew that once the season started and her siblings were out playing she would want to as well. She is still playing rec and can hardly wait for the new season to start up. (she does not travel or do fall ball)
I think for us it was a case of knowing my kid. If my other 2 say the same thing at this age (which I highly doubt- they are both in travel and LOVE IT) I would do the same and encourage them through it.
She often says my "Making Her" play was the best thing I ever did for her.
1bzymom
 
Posts: 48
Joined: Mon Sep 20, 2010 12:00 pm

by Momo's Dad » Fri Nov 12, 2010 11:29 am

1bzymom wrote:My 16 year old could have been one of those "I quit" at 13 but I did not allow her. I made her sign up for Spring rec because I knew that once the season started and her siblings were out playing she would want to as well. She is still playing rec and can hardly wait for the new season to start up. (she does not travel or do fall ball)
I think for us it was a case of knowing my kid. If my other 2 say the same thing at this age (which I highly doubt- they are both in travel and LOVE IT) I would do the same and encourage them through it.
She often says my "Making Her" play was the best thing I ever did for her.


Outstanding! My daughter's mom made her play last spring and it seems to have been the right move, because she's loving it now. I'm an advocate of letting kids choose their activities, but at these young ages - or even at age 13 - they need us to prod them in a direction we just know they want to go in, even if they're dreading those less than fun preseason workouts. One of the major roadblocks I've run into so far in recruiting people back to the league are the parents of kids who won't decide until mid-March that they'd rather be on a team than having no sport to play all season.

It's going to be a tough battle this winter, but I'm hoping for a significantly higher return rate among the younger girls this year than we've had in the recent past.
Momo's Dad
 
Posts: 103
Joined: Mon Oct 04, 2010 12:12 pm

by Momo's Dad » Fri Nov 12, 2010 11:54 am

Arto - Thanks so much for the idea of bringing in a pitching coach for the league. Although I've not presented a proposal to the Board yet, I have gotten a commitment from a coach who is willing to come out every weekend to work with the girls who want to learn how to pitch. She's one of those rare super-volunteers in the world who just wants to see more girls having the opportunity to succeed and enjoy the game. That's exactly the sort of break we need in our town, where so few people have the ability to pay $65/hour for private lessons.
Momo's Dad
 
Posts: 103
Joined: Mon Oct 04, 2010 12:12 pm

by GIMNEPIWO » Fri Nov 12, 2010 6:27 pm

Momo's Dad wrote:One of my points of emphasis is limiting roster size at 6u and eliminating the catcher position.

In the 3 years I've been here, because T-ballers are generally the last to sign up, teams end up with between 11 and 13 girls on each roster. As a result, one of the common defensive formations is a 12-girl infield which doesn't do much in the way of helping girls learn about the positions they're playing. And honestly, when it comes to t-ball, what purpose do outfielders serve?

My thought is that rosters should be 6-7 girls each, with the 5 standard positions, plus a rover. If a team has 7 players dressed, the 7th would be the lone outfielder or could don the catcher's gear at the coach's discretion.


The benefits to going with smaller rosters would be that the girls would get more reps in the field and could get 4 at-bats per game as opposed to the current 2 at-bats. As things stand right now, a girl could conceivably play an entire season and field only one ball, or less.

Is there any benefit to having a catcher in t-ball?


Mo-man ... you have raised a good thread for convo here ... but seem to contradict yourself as highlighted above ...

Arto & Mo-meister ... hiring a pitching coach for gals @ 6U & 8U ? ... IDK ?... That sounds like a deal that is more about the Parents than it is about the kids to me ... BUT, then again, I was the terrible monster Dad that had my kids at music lessons at that age ... so, WTF do I know ? ...LMAOWIOAB!
"For the strength of the pack is the wolf, the strength of the wolf is the pack" Rudyard Kipling
User avatar
GIMNEPIWO
 
Posts: 4339
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2008 6:58 am
Location: Between Rock & Hard Place

by Momo's Dad » Sat Nov 13, 2010 3:18 pm

GIMNEPIWO wrote:Mo-man ... you have raised a good thread for convo here ... but seem to contradict yourself as highlighted above ...

Arto & Mo-meister ... hiring a pitching coach for gals @ 6U & 8U ? ... IDK ?... That sounds like a deal that is more about the Parents than it is about the kids to me ... BUT, then again, I was the terrible monster Dad that had my kids at music lessons at that age ... so, WTF do I know ? ...LMAOWIOAB!


Although I'm not planning to make mistakes, I know that mistakes will be made, but hopefully the process will produce a better result year-over-year.

Our entire region is committed to player pitch for 8u. I've pondered what life could be like if we all went to machine pitch, but I just don't see it happening. A huge hurdle to contend with is the percentage of sports parents who fear their child being left behind if they aren't doing x, y, and z by a certain age. Here in the Sacramento region, the parents have made it clear that pitcher development has priority over overall player development and that's the culture we live with.

Pitching instruction is expensive. There aren't that many providers, and those who want their kids to become pitchers and can afford it are paying tremendously high rates. We can argue that it's about the parents, and while many may have a problem, I'm ok with it (being about the parents). But what I'm not ok with is pitching being reserved for the wealthy. At some point, a girl may need to get a job in order to pay for her lessons, but we're not going to send 7-8 year old girls out to babysit. They should be able to find decent instruction for a decent price.

As for how our league would benefit, this year, our season began with 4 (or 5) pitchers for 6 teams. If we get more girls out there who are capable of pitching, then the overall product becomes a better value for the girls and their parents, making both more likely to want to return the following year.

When you look at it that way, I don't think it's that crazy at all.
Last edited by Momo's Dad on Mon Nov 15, 2010 7:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
Momo's Dad
 
Posts: 103
Joined: Mon Oct 04, 2010 12:12 pm

by GIMNEPIWO » Mon Nov 15, 2010 6:50 am

Momo's Dad wrote:
GIMNEPIWO wrote:Mo-man ... you have raised a good thread for convo here ... but seem to contradict yourself as highlighted above ...

Arto & Mo-meister ... hiring a pitching coach for gals @ 6U & 8U ? ... IDK ?... That sounds like a deal that is more about the Parents than it is about the kids to me ... BUT, then again, I was the terrible monster Dad that had my kids at music lessons at that age ... so, WTF do I know ? ...LMAOWIOAB!


Although I'm not planning to make mistakes, I know that mistakes will be made, but hopefully the process will produce a better result year over over.

Our entire region is committed to player pitch for 8u. I've pondered what life could be like if we all went to machine pitch, but I just don't see it happening. A huge hurdle to contend with is the percentage of sports parents who fear their child being left behind if they aren't doing x, y, and z by a certain age. Here in the Sacremento region, the parents have made it clear that pitcher development has priority over overall player development and that's the culture we live with.

Pitching instruction is expensive. There aren't that many providers, and those who want their kids to become pitchers and can afford it and paying tremendously high rates. We can argue that it's about the parents, and while many may have a problem, I'm ok with it. But what I'm not ok with is pitching being reserved for the wealthy. At some point, a girl may need to get a job in order to pay for her lessons, but we're not going to send 7-8 year old girls out to babysit. They should be able to find decent instruction for a decent price.

As for how our league would benefit, this year, our season began with 4 (or 5) pitchers for 6 teams. If we get more girls out there who are capable of pitching, then the overall product becomes a better value for the girls and their parents, making both more likely to want to return the following year.

When you look at it that way, I don't think it's that crazy at all.


I can see how it would make for better if not faster moving games at that age ... It's been a very long time ... but what I remember from that age is that it was all I could do to keep the kids focused on not making pictures in the infield dirt or doing outfield helicopters ... :lol:
"For the strength of the pack is the wolf, the strength of the wolf is the pack" Rudyard Kipling
User avatar
GIMNEPIWO
 
Posts: 4339
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2008 6:58 am
Location: Between Rock & Hard Place

by Momo's Dad » Mon Nov 15, 2010 8:10 am

GIMNEPIWO wrote:I can see how it would make for better if not faster moving games at that age ... It's been a very long time ... but what I remember from that age is that it was all I could do to keep the kids focused on not making pictures in the infield dirt or doing outfield helicopters ... :lol:


Exactly. I may not like it, but I have to accept that a significant number - and perhaps even a majority - of Americans want instant gratification. Whether it's weight loss or the economy, people want everything solved right now.

Although parents complain a lot, if we manage them more like consumers and less like parents, I believe that will help to strengthen the rec programs, which can only grow from the bottom up. And while no one is expecting all-star play out of 50% of the 7-year-olds out there, parents do want to see some degree of proficiency and INTEREST from their girls and that's not happening when the games drag on like they do in some areas. So, as a league, we've got to make every reasonable effort to put a better product on the field.

After having a few more conversations with parents over this weekend, it seems I'm not alone in thinking that having outfielders in t-ball is a complete waste of time. Maybe it was just a matter of not wanting to be disagreeable, but my suggestion of having a 6-player roster vs 12 continues to be well-received. They all want to see their kids getting more reps in the field and at the plate.

At 8u, same thing - parents hate coach pitch, regardless of how well their daughters might hit soft toss. :roll: For the most part, every girl who wants to try to pitch in rec gets the chance, even if she and her parents could care less about her working on it outside of practice time. And if you've got a catcher who doesn't understand the term 'hustle', it can be a long day spent watching the retrieval of wild pitches just so that the coach can come out a few minutes later. Seeing this process repeated over and over makes the game less fun for everyone, and that's why we see so many 10u non-rec teams popping up in California. Parents bolt the first chance they get, and they take their kids with them.

I'm continuing with word-of-mouth recruiting, and I'm working on developing an equipment swap setup that will enable girls to try out the game for a fraction of the cost. There's also been a great deal of interest in the pre-season clinic, as girls who've never played before will get a chance to learn some skills and try the game to see if they like it before committing themselves and their parents to a full season.

It's unlikely I'll be around here in 20 years, but I'll definitely be here for the next 5 and if we stay the course and commit to t-ball/8u, I guarantee this league will be much stronger by 2015.

My daughter and I had a good time watching the 16u end-of-season tournament we hosted yesterday, but it was a bit disappointing that our league was unable to field a team to participate. Hopefully that won't be the case by the time she's 16. :)
Momo's Dad
 
Posts: 103
Joined: Mon Oct 04, 2010 12:12 pm

by Poseidon » Mon Nov 15, 2010 10:34 am

Hi Momo's dad,

I would like to suggest that you take a look at a program that we use in Canada. It's called "Learn To Play". Some information can get found on Softball Canada's website (www.softball.ca) under their programs sub-menu.

I am a Kinesiology Professor (Biomechanics and Neural Control of Movement) with a background in elite level sports training. When my daughters took a liking to softball (In Iowa City, IA) I was lucky to be nominated to be in charge of organizing the U6-U7 division. Like you I was not happy with the amount of downtime for the kids while playing T-Ball and coach pitch so I started looking at what other associations had been doing.

We introduced the "Learn to Play" concept, with some minor modifications so the culture shift was not too big, and kids as well as parents liked it.

Before coming back to Canada I also introduced machine pitch for the U8-U9 divisions. My main rational for introducing machine pitch was that it is actually harder to hit a ball toss at a slower speed by an adult because it will have a large vertical displacement contrary to a faster ball that will have less vertical displacement in it's trajectory. The players learned quite easily to adapt to the increase ball speed and had more confidence when trying to hit. In my opinion, this is the first step in building a good mechanical foundation for hitting.

The last point I would like to make is that all through this process we taught windmill pitching for these age groups through pitching clinics and during team/league practice. That allowed the players to be minimally proficient in their pitching technique by the time they were U10 and it allowed for much more enjoyable games for both players and parents.

If you would like more informations (the Learn To Play Programs in PDF format) just send me a PM and I will forward you the info.

Have a great time,
Michel
Poseidon
 
Posts: 22
Joined: Thu Apr 17, 2008 6:33 pm

PreviousNext

Return to Fastpitch Discussions