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player release for nationals

What's on your mind?

by Sam » Sat Jul 14, 2018 8:18 am

My kids were 16U and had the opportunity to play for college coaches. I could have chosen to take my team to Western Nationals and forced the kids to stay with me but I thought it would be better to disband the team and let the kids further their softball dreams.....which they did.

You especially don’t release the younger kids. You have to train the parents. If you release, you have trained the parents to do what they damn well please for the rest of the kid’s softball career.

I noticed nobody has espoused where they allegedly coach. Interesting.
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by ucla_animal » Sun Jul 15, 2018 10:36 am

Slightly different scenario...but wanted to get your opinion. We played in the last so cal pgf qualifier and got knocked out by a team with a solid pitcher. Two weeks later, went to TCS world series, and saw that pitcher pitch against us with a different team in that same organization. THAT team was already qualified for PGF, but the team that she pitched on in Lake Elsinore was not.

Seems like BS that PGF lets an organization share players from teams that are already qualified to other teams in the org that are not yet qualified...but if that's the case, certainly makes it tougher on the independent teams out there...thoughts?
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by ucla_animal » Tue Jul 17, 2018 5:22 pm

Yes, I'm not arguing that TCS should have checked the roster, but I'm surprised that PGF would let a player from a team that has an invite (earned or invited) play on another team that is trying to earn an invite...I would assume they would be locked on that team, like this whole discussion...I just thought it was strange...it was clear that she was not a member of the team that she pitched on at PGF because that same team was at TCS and she wasn't pitching for them.
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by onlooker » Wed Jul 18, 2018 7:30 am

ucla_animal wrote:Yes, I'm not arguing that TCS should have checked the roster, but I'm surprised that PGF would let a player from a team that has an invite (earned or invited) play on another team that is trying to earn an invite...I would assume they would be locked on that team, like this whole discussion...I just thought it was strange...it was clear that she was not a member of the team that she pitched on at PGF because that same team was at TCS and she wasn't pitching for them.


Not surprised at all....

I will repeat it here so everyone sees it.

Invites, and Returning Berth's rosters are NOT due until the PGF Roster deadline. So they can play all f'n year long with whoever they want AND anyone on their team can play for anyone they want, and will have to abide by all qualifier locked rules if they play in a qualifier. You see, every player people think are on all these invites are NOT locked on a roster as they are NOT playing qualifiers and are NOT

This really is my whole point why the original coach in this post is a DICK (I get its a female coach who maybe just might not understand how it works) for not immediately releasing the player when the season ENDED. the Invite they got was clearly after the season ended. Season is over. back to ucla question.......

Now, lets look at this closer, and I will spell it out.....

Girl who played in nationals last year (pick the org, A's, Angels, Exposion, Beverly Bandits, Birmingham TBolts... it doesnt matter... any of the invites are NOT required to turn their rosters in until the deadline!! so these girls who we all think are on a certain team, well they aren't, until a roster is turned in.

Now, you should begin to start seeing how it works in so cal.... the top teams in the country field the best teams they can to compete at PGF with the following:

1. Clear top team per age group (See stith, tyson, shea, conroy, merrida)
2. Want to get as many of the org as possible in PGF
3. see #2, yet all need to have the best roster they can to also possibly win without a sacrifice to #1

There is a clear agenda to send as many teams as an org can (why the hell not?, ive got nothing wrong with these agendas, i get it,....)
There is a clear agenda to stack all the teams the best they can to compete at the best level they can.
lets face it... bandits will have 5 worthy starters in 18U circle... maybe more. why would they leave em all on Conroy?


When you have a clear timeline that can be "taken advantage" of within the rules, you get top orgs mastering how to shuffle talent. This is NOT going away unless invites have to turn in rosters within 2 weeks of invite/acceptance.

You see, everyone sees the rules, most everyone plays by the rules, but a LOT of people still scratch their head and wonder why certain girls who they thought were on one team are now playing on another in the org, in a qualifier. It's for the good of the org and in MOST cases its for the good of the girl.

this is how it works.

does everyone get it now?

Invites and returning berths have no roster requirement other than turning their roster in at deadline. (all players have to be eligible of course)

This is a loophole, and it IS exploited..
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by onlooker » Wed Jul 18, 2018 7:48 am

I said above in most cases its for the good of the girl.

sadly, the other side of that coin, is the 3 pitchers who pitched in all the qualifiers and played the whole year with that team, will now cede their position to a girl who was not with the team all year and will probably eat most of their innings up.

cruel game sometimes, but this is how it works.
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by jonriv » Wed Jul 18, 2018 8:50 am

onlooker wrote:I said above in most cases its for the good of the girl.

sadly, the other side of that coin, is the 3 pitchers who pitched in all the qualifiers and played the whole year with that team, will now cede their position to a girl who was not with the team all year and will probably eat most of their innings up.

cruel game sometimes, but this is how it works.



Thanks for your insight and clear explanation of the policy/rules

I have seen the practice you describe. I understand all the reasons, but frankly it sucks!! It really benefits the organization and the coach's ego. IMO the only a few good reasons for teams to bring "recently roster" added players:

1) Player on team is unable to go to tournament leaving an opening

2) Adding a player on a smaller roster(with the understanding that they are there to fill in if needed)

Never (IMO) should a player that has played, practiced, and worked(and paid!) with a team all season lose playing time to a ringer brought in to ensure better results in a tournament. As mentioned on other posts, in the long run the trophies mean nothing, but the development of a player(young lady) is everything.

My daughter's travel coach was urged twice by the head of the organization to bring players like mentioned, he refused saying it was unfair to the girls who had worked so hard and sent the wrong message.
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by onlooker » Wed Jul 18, 2018 10:24 am

I agree 110% jon riv.. The motive really is for the good of the Org/Coach/pocketbooks , (follow the money)

i am with you.
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by Player player » Fri Jul 27, 2018 9:56 pm

All this coach wanted to do was hurt the player with her ego. Karma
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by Sam » Mon Jul 30, 2018 6:36 am

Player player wrote:All this coach wanted to do was hurt the player with her ego. Karma
Orange County is a small world!!


The same player that signed up to play with the team until the season was finished......and left......after all the teams had been formed. Who hurt who? She didn't live up to her end of the bargain. She is being legally held accountable. Karma found HER.
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by Hinky » Mon Jul 30, 2018 8:31 am

here's another pgf rule variation / loophole -players in pgf whose teams are given a return invite are actually released from that roster and allowed to go play on other teams in pgf! Without coaches release! (yep !! all those teams/orgs that have new & ongoing return invites) They are not obligated stay on that roster, until a future date
(like July 1st *not certain of that date.)

for instance this year one of the top teams picked up a different coach and several of the players did not care for that coach, they told head coach hey this is a deal-breaker they decided to keep the new coach and the players left the team and went to play for a different team for pgf.

as far as making a blanket statement "once you make a commitment you need to keep a commitment" I think sounds foolish especially when things can turn toxic. Too many variables that can change. And especially in this story we do not know all the variables but we do know that toxic happens.

we know even in college that coaches leave at a spur-of-the-moment whether they're fired or choose to take a different position elsewhere and those players are left in the unknown. Perhaps that new rule in NCAA where players
only need to notify their college they will not be returning rather than having to make a request of separation. Perhaps that is to equalize the situation and give players the opportunity to make a reassessment to their commitment as the original people and circumstances have changed.
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