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what is purpose of dropped third strike rule?

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by DonnieS » Sat May 08, 2010 6:09 am

coxjj wrote:
Crabby_Bob wrote:To coxjj's point: the defense must play well too. For example, the batter hits an easy ground ball to shortstop, who fields it and makes the throw to first base on time, except nobody is there. The batter isn't successful, he hasn't "earned" the right to first base, therefore, call him out.

No. The game is about good play, fielding, throwing, catching, quickness, hitting away from fielders. The game is setup to require good play from offense and defense.


I never said the batter didn't earn the right to first base, I said the the batter didn't earn the right to reach first base. Putting the ball into play allows you the opportunity to get to first. Whether you make it there or not has nothing to do with the right you earned to reach base ... that already occurred when you hit a fair ball. Whether you hit it hard or soft, high or low, right at a fielder or right at no one, and what the defense did to react to it, doesn't do anything to the batter's right to reach base ... it just needs to be a fair ball. All of that enters into determining whether you get to stay there, but not your ability to try to get there in the first place. On a D3K, the offense did NOTHING to earn the right to get there; they totally failed.



Thats exactly my daughter's point on a hbp. "If she is so dumb that she cant get out of the way of a pitch, how does that give her the right to first base." That's my sweet flower of a darling daughter's opinion, not mine.
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by Uncle Rico » Sat May 08, 2010 8:06 am

If they didn't give the batter first base on a HBP, maybe your sweet flower would throw one to the ribs of every batter. Just to see if they were smart enough to get out of the way :lol:
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by DonnieS » Sat May 08, 2010 3:30 pm

Uncle Rico wrote:If they didn't give the batter first base on a HBP, maybe your sweet flower would throw one to the ribs of every batter. Just to see if they were smart enough to get out of the way :lol:


I explained that to her... carefully... I catch for her a lot and try not to piss her off.
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by aojr03 » Sun May 09, 2010 11:50 am

The ridiculous part of the rule is when the catcher catches the ball cleanly from a pitch in the dirt. The batter still has to the opportunity to run to 1st and the catcher has to throw her out. In that case the pitcher made a good pitch to get the the K, the catcher fielded the ball, and the batter failed.
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by DonnieS » Sun May 09, 2010 1:46 pm

aojr03 wrote:The ridiculous part of the rule is when the catcher catches the ball cleanly from a pitch in the dirt. The batter still has to the opportunity to run to 1st and the catcher has to throw her out. In that case the pitcher made a good pitch to get the the K, the catcher fielded the ball, and the batter failed.


Pick your battles pal, this rule has been around since 1845 or so. Better use of time is teach the catchers to catch the ball cleanly.
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by UmpSteve » Sun May 09, 2010 4:09 pm

aojr03 wrote:The ridiculous part of the rule is when the catcher catches the ball cleanly from a pitch in the dirt. The batter still has to the opportunity to run to 1st and the catcher has to throw her out. In that case the pitcher made a good pitch to get the the K, the catcher fielded the ball, and the batter failed.


Think about what you are saying. If any fielder "catches" a batted ball "cleanly ... from the dirt", is it a "catch"? I will assume (and hope; otherwise I am wasting the effort) your response is "no".

If that is not a "catch", why would you think that a pitched ball that hits the ground before being controlled by the catcher is a "catch"??
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by tcannizzo » Mon May 10, 2010 4:52 pm

ssarge wrote:
That would make the runner at 1st at liability to be put out on a ball not technically put in play. Having a double play on a D3K would seem a bit too advantageous to the defense.


Sounds absolutely right, good thought.


Not sure if I see the logic here. Because it is only valid when 1st base is occupied and there is 2 outs. IOW not in play with 1B occupied and less than 2 outs.
Last edited by tcannizzo on Mon May 10, 2010 5:02 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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by Spazsdad » Mon May 10, 2010 4:57 pm

tcannizzo wrote:
ssarge wrote:
That would make the runner at 1st at liability to be put out on a ball not technically put in play. Having a double play on a D3K would seem a bit too advantageous to the defense.


Sounds absolutely right, good thought.


Not sure if I see the logic here. Because it is only valid when 1st base is occupied and there is 2 outs. IOW not in play with 1B occupied and less than 2 outs.
Havent read the whole thread yet, so this may be already answered.

The original question I replied to was:
I think a bigger anomaly is why you can't run on a dropped third with a baserunner at 1st and less than 2 outs.
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by tcannizzo » Mon May 10, 2010 5:03 pm

Did some searching and thought this made sense:
"For any out, the defense must be in control of the ball. Drop a fly
ball, the batter is not out; drop the ball on a play at first, the
batter-runner is not out; drop the ball on a tag, the runner is not
out. And so on. It is no different on a dropped third strike.
Catching the third strike is a natural thing to require."
author unknown.

Infield Fly Rule is a notable exception, except that it has easily understood logic for the exception.
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